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-   -   What is the ATF? (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f97/what-atf-51688/)

gunny134 11-13-2011 02:20 AM

What is the ATF?
 
I know I could just go onto the Internet and look this up but I know I will get better answers here than on the Internet.

texaswoodworker 11-13-2011 02:28 AM

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (BATFE aka the ATF) deals with everthing involving alcoholm tobacco, firearms, and explosives. They inforce the laws that surround them, and sometimes tries to create new ones.

We don't like the ATF. Ever here of operation Fast and Furious? It was their fault and they are blaming the 2nd Amendment for it. They pretty much want to do away with the 2A or make it very hard to get a gun.

gunny134 11-13-2011 02:37 AM

Oh okay thank you.

bkt 11-13-2011 03:23 AM

The ATF is a tax collection agency when it was under Treasury, but now that it's under Department of Justice it still collects taxes and it enforces law, virtually none of which are constitutional.

KalashnikovJosh 11-13-2011 05:36 AM

What is the ATF?

The BATFE,acronym standing for the Bureau of Alcohol,Tobacco,Firearms and Explosives,more lovingly referenced to as the BATFEces or the JBT's (Jack Booted Thugs) by their FONDEST admirers (lol) is a constitutionally illegitimate enforcement agency of the out of control federal government which is DIRECTLY responsible for the murder and unlawful imprisonment of American citizens,the illegal sale and traffic of arms to Foreign Enemies,and High Treason based upon the violation of the Constitution,primarily the Second Amendment via bureaucratic enforcement of illegitimate "gun control" laws.

To support my "outlandish" and "outrageous" claims against these government sanctioned criminals,I like to quote Thomas Jefferson from his Kentucky Resolutions to describe the LAWFUL "police power" of the federal government-

"Resolved, That the Constitution of the United States, having delegated to Congress a power to punish treason, counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States, piracies, and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations, and no other crimes, whatsoever........."
-Thomas Jefferson,Kentucky Resolutions of 1798

Indeed,the entire Constitution was written to form a limited government,and in particular,to endue that the new government would not act on unlimited power,which would threaten the sovereignty of the states that created it and the Individual Liberty of We,The People.
When the government claims for itself powers not delegated,in particular the authority to "regulate" in areas not granted,and in the case of the Arms owned by Private Citizens,in areas SPECIFICALLY PROHIBITED BY LAW,NAMELY THE SECOND AMENDMENT,it is important to note,to quote Jefferson from the Resolutions yet again-

"......that whensoever the general government assumes undelegated powers, its acts are unauthoritative, void, and of no force....."
-Thomas Jefferson,Kentucky Resolutions of 1798

So,basically,the police powers,or the crimes prosecutable by the federal government; and thus the Duties they may create Offices Necessary and Proper to enforce,are limited by law and easily explained by referring to the writings of our Founders as well as the document that constituted the federal government- The Constitution.

Further,as per the Second Amendment-

"A well-regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."
-United States Constitution, Second Amendment

The federal government IS NOT given legal latitude to INFRINGE on the RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS.
This means they may not make ANY laws,regulations,legislation,etc. that infringes on this INALIENABLE RIGHT.

Ultimately,this means "gun control" is illegal.

Thus,the LAWS the BATFE enforces are illegal and illegitimate themselves.

So,it boils down to an illegitimate federal police agency enforcing illegitimate and blatantly illegal laws,and doing so in a manner that ENDANGERS THE PEOPLE either by the agencies' members DIRECT use of force or by the INDIRECT CONSEQUENCES of its policies and agendas.
They are also known to use elaborate entrapment schemes as well as prosecute people for even the simplest issues that otherwise are NOT crimes committed against any innocent persons(victim-less crimes),and to "make up the rules as they go" and have used bureaucratic regulation to lock otherwise innocent people up for DECADES.

They once tried to classify a shoelace as a "part" that could make a firearm "an unregistered machine gun".

Put simply-
THE BATFE IS NOT YOUR FRIEND.

Go here for more info-

http://jpfo.org/filegen-a-m/bootbatfe.htm

Firearms4ever 11-13-2011 05:42 AM

Well, Kalishnikov summed it up pretty well and so did BKT.

texaswoodworker 11-13-2011 05:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KalashnikovJosh (Post 626409)
What is the ATF?

A constitutionally illegitimate enforcement agency of the out of control federal government which is DIRECTLY responsible for the murder and unlawful imprisonment of American citizens,the illegal sale and traffic of arms to Foreign Enemies,and High Treason based upon the violation of the Constitution,primarily the Second Amendment via bureaucratic enforcement of illegitimate "gun control" laws.

To support my "outlandish" and "outrageous" claims against these government sanctioned criminals,I like to quote Thomas Jefferson from his Kentucky Resolutions to describe the LAWFUL "police power" of the federal government-

"Resolved, That the Constitution of the United States, having delegated to Congress a power to punish treason, counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States, piracies, and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations, and no other crimes, whatsoever........."
-Thomas Jefferson,Kentucky Resolutions of 1798

Indeed,the entire Constitution was written to form a limited government,and in particular,to secure the rights of the people.
When the government claims for itself powers not delegated,in particular the authority to "regulate" in areas not granted,and in the case of the Arms owned by Private Citizens,in areas SPECIFICALLY PROHIBITED BY LAW,NAMELY THE SECOND AMENDMENT,it is important to note,to quote Jefferson from the Resolutions yet again-

"......that whensoever the general government assumes undelegated powers, its acts are unauthoritative, void, and of no force....."
-Thomas Jefferson,Kentucky Resolutions of 1798

So,basically,the police powers,or the crimes prosecutable by the federal government; and thus the Duties they may create Offices Necessary and Proper to enforce,are limited by law and easily explained by referring to the writings of our Founders as well as the document that constituted the federal government- The Constitution.

Further,as per the Second Amendment-

"A well-regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."
-United States Constitution, Second Amendment

The federal government IS NOT given legal latitude to INFRINGE on the RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS.
This means they may not make ANY laws,regulations,legislation,etc. that infringes on this INALIENABLE RIGHT.

Thus,the LAWS the BATFE enforces are illegal and illegitimate themselves.

So,it boils down to an illegitimate federal police agency enforcing illegitimate and blatantly illegal laws.

What he said.:D

robocop10mm 11-13-2011 06:27 AM

ATF - BATFE; Bureau of Atrocities, Tragedies, Fiascoes and Entrapment.

unclebear 11-13-2011 07:13 AM

to put it in simple terms a organization that's run by a bunch of people with there heads up there a*s, that like to be a giant pain in my side...

gunny134 11-13-2011 01:33 PM

Alright thank you now I get it. ATF=BAD!


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