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Old 09-05-2013, 12:21 AM   #81
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If a person simply carries the long gun slung over the shoulder, it is impossible to establish it was done to cause alarm. They unsling it and "menace" others, yes an offense.
i disagree a bit here...imo if you have no purpose in carrying a firearm whatsoever....

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"Exercising" your rights is not a problem. "Flaunting" your rights gets problematic. It does not really do anything to perpetuate the right. It does cause people to call their legislators and ask for the law to be changed. Case in point; California's open cary of unloaded handguns is now illegal precicely because "activists" thought it a good idea to flaunt it. Does that seem like a good idea now?
BINGO! well said.

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I am a firm believer in CC. The BG's do not know who is armed so they have to be careful. Giving pause to the BG's reduces crime. A surprise injection of lead to the brain of a BG reduces crime even further.
THANK YOU! exactly! as i've said before....open carry has no advantage over CC, and that is why it leaves me scratching my head that anyone makes a big deal out of it....i like to have every BG think..."he/she MAY be carrying....."

we haven't always seen eye to eye (that's ok) but if i could give you 100 likes for this post...i would....
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Old 09-05-2013, 12:53 AM   #82
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Open carry's biggest (and only, as far as I can tell) real advantage over CC is speed on the draw.

But there are many reasons one may choose to open carry (and I assume we're talking about "normal" OC, meaning a handgun on the hip).

Some prefer it for comfort. It simply wears differently.

There's the speed advantage that some people prefer.

For some, and in this case I'm speaking personally, it's the only legal means available at the moment. This happens when you have no or little restrictions on open carry, but a concealed carry permit requires money you simply don't have available. This is specifically my case. I can open carry for free, but need a little over $200 to get a concealed carry permit. Considering I'm just over minimum wage, and keep having unexpected expenses come along (like my recent eviction and having to find a new place to live), I simply can't get the money scraped together at the right time.

One big argument against OC is that "you're painting a target on your back. The criminals are going to shoot you first." I FUGGING HATE this argument. There's no proof of this being a viable threat, only a very few recorded instances (most of which involve LEOs, whom fall into a whole other category from the LAC, due to professional risks), and contrarily, there have been about as many instances of Open Carry serving as a deterrent.

Another argument against it, is just about the same argument that's been beaten like a dead horse here, "You're just looking for attention and playing Mr. Macho Man. You must think you're Rambo or some ****." Now, I can't stand the turds who are out looking for a confrontation with LEO while having their long gun strapped across their back. As you've read Robo's comments and supporting posts on "flaunting", I'll cut that part short and simply say I agree with him (actually, I posted about it myself on the first page of this thread). But, and this is a line I've used before almost verbatim, "The single dad in the grocery store's drink mix section, discussing with his 7 year old kid which flavor Kool-Aid goes best with fried chicken, is NOT the guy out looking to be a social media/youtube star." He simply is using the means available to protect himself and that which he loves.

Now, without getting into a pro/con discussion; because I get very vehement, and quite frankly, mean, over it. I feel personally insulted when people question my actions without knowing my reasoning, but ESPECIALLY mad when people fling accusations at me about my reasoning, or what they suppose to be my reasonings, so, I'll leave off with this: Does it matter? Unless someone is causing a public disturbance, does it really matter?

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Old 09-05-2013, 01:26 AM   #83
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I don't give two ****s if you respect me. I'm just telling you that you should respect a guys rights who wants to carry a rifle. It doesn't matter how many grandmothers he scares. It's not a about what you or I would do. It's none of our business. This attitude of I don't like it so he shouldn't be allowed to do it is BS. If a cop sees a guy walking down the street with his rifle and he's not doing anything illegal, why bust his balls about it? Wouldn't be any videos to show if the cops just did their job properly. By that I mean leave law abiding citizens alone.

They can't just assume because he's got a rifle that he's going to do something bad. Hell if they did that they'd have to stop every man just to make sure he's not a rapist, I mean after all he's carrying a loaded penis. Or they'd have to stop every woman to make sure she's not a prostitute, she's got the equipment.

When you start telling people that this gun is ok but that one isn't you sound just like the anti gun people. Remember biden. you don't need a handgun or an AR just get a double barrel shotgun. If a guy wants to be a douche that's his business I'm not for taking his rights away from him just because I don't perceive him as being as smart as me. That's pretty damned elitist.
Look. You need to calm down. You've basically lost this argument. I put a few things in bold that I'll address. And here's why you've lost the argument:

No one said we shouldn't be allowed to OC. Not one person here is arguing open carry shouldn't be allowed. We all support people who are doing it reasonably, because we all believe its their right.

As I understand it, a cop's job is not to "leave law abiding citizens alone." A cop's job is to respond to people's calls. If someone gets freaked out because someone is OCing, and they call the cops, the cops are doing their job by responding to the call. They are obligated to.

You're putting words in our mouth. No one ever said "this gun is ok, but this one isn't." They were simply saying OCing a long gun on your back walking around with a camera trying to stir sh*t up, is not exercising your right. It is stirring the pot just for the sake of it. OCing because that is your legal avenue you have to carry a weapon, as Trip said, is perfectly fine. Hell, even if you have a CCW permit, and you want to OC, that's perfectly fine. Standing on a corner with a camera is grandstanding. In most localities that actually is illegal, as far as I know.

As I said, if you want the law changed, protest in front of the legislature. Write your congressmen. Get a petition started. Go on a radio talk show. Etc.

Your whole premise is that we don't support OC. Well, we do. So come up with a new premise. Or just shut up. Because its obvious to me you are severely missing the point of what everyone is saying.
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:40 AM   #84
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We have the right to own guns because of the constitution.
But we still need to follow the state laws that we live in.
I have the freedom of speech is it ok for me to yell fire in a crowded movie theater ? No because it will cause panic.
It's the same thing if a person is carrying a long gun down the road to a gunsmith that is on the other side of a school. It's the same thing.
One person trying to make a point is not an activist, they are a$$hats. Just like that guy who wanted to carry a loaded shotgun in DC, film a 5min video a got the hell out of there before the cop showed up.

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Old 09-05-2013, 01:44 AM   #85
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Look. You need to calm down. You've basically lost this argument. I put a few things in bold that I'll address. And here's why you've lost the argument:

No one said we shouldn't be allowed to OC. Not one person here is arguing open carry shouldn't be allowed. We all support people who are doing it reasonably, because we all believe its their right.

As I understand it, a cop's job is not to "leave law abiding citizens alone." A cop's job is to respond to people's calls. If someone gets freaked out because someone is OCing, and they call the cops, the cops are doing their job by responding to the call. They are obligated to.

You're putting words in our mouth. No one ever said "this gun is ok, but this one isn't." They were simply saying OCing a long gun on your back walking around with a camera trying to stir sh*t up, is not exercising your right. It is stirring the pot just for the sake of it. OCing because that is your legal avenue you have to carry a weapon, as Trip said, is perfectly fine. Hell, even if you have a CCW permit, and you want to OC, that's perfectly fine. Standing on a corner with a camera is grandstanding. In most localities that actually is illegal, as far as I know.

As I said, if you want the law changed, protest in front of the legislature. Write your congressmen. Get a petition started. Go on a radio talk show. Etc.

Your whole premise is that we don't support OC. Well, we do. So come up with a new premise. Or just shut up. Because its obvious to me you are severely missing the point of what everyone is saying.


I need to calm down? WTF? I was never not calm. I wasn't the one calling people immature little wimps. I'm not the one calling people douchebags. When you say you don't want people carrying their rifles. You most certainly are telling them which gun or type of gun is ok for them to carry. 2A doesn't say I have to carry a handgun, in fact back when 2A was written handguns weren't too common. Most carried their muskets.

These guys aren't trying to get a law changed. It is already legal for them to carry. That's why the cops shouldn't be busting their chops. What these guys are filming is cops who don't know the laws. What I don't understand is why you guys think it's ok for cop to draw a paycheck when he doesn't even know the laws he's supposed to enforce. I don't understand what part of "shall not be infringed" you don't get.
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:45 AM   #86
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Look. You need to calm down. You've basically lost this argument. I put a few things in bold that I'll address. And here's why you've lost the argument:

No one said we shouldn't be allowed to OC. Not one person here is arguing open carry shouldn't be allowed. We all support people who are doing it reasonably, because we all believe its their right.

As I understand it, a cop's job is not to "leave law abiding citizens alone." A cop's job is to respond to people's calls. If someone gets freaked out because someone is OCing, and they call the cops, the cops are doing their job by responding to the call. They are obligated to.
Bingo! You hit the nail on the head as usual sir.

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You're putting words in our mouth. No one ever said "this gun is ok, but this one isn't." They were simply saying OCing a long gun on your back walking around with a camera trying to stir sh*t up, is not exercising your right. It is stirring the pot just for the sake of it. OCing because that is your legal avenue you have to carry a weapon, as Trip said, is perfectly fine. Hell, even if you have a CCW permit, and you want to OC, that's perfectly fine. Standing on a corner with a camera is grandstanding. In most localities that actually is illegal, as far as I know.

As I said, if you want the law changed, protest in front of the legislature. Write your congressmen. Get a petition started. Go on a radio talk show. Etc.

Your whole premise is that we don't support OC. Well, we do. So come up with a new premise. Or just shut up. Because its obvious to me you are severely missing the point of what everyone is saying.
I doubt he'll listen. Like the you tubers he is desperately trying to draw attention to himself and going about it the wrong way for the wrong reasons. I personally think you have summed this all up very nicely. You have a great way of doing this most of the time and I enjoy reading your posts. Keep up the good work!
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:48 AM   #87
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We have the right to own guns because of the constitution.
But we still need to follow the state laws that we live in.
I have the freedom of speech is it ok for me to yell fire in a crowded movie theater ? No because it will cause panic.
It's the same thing if a person is carrying a long gun down the road to a gunsmith that is on the other side of a school. It's the same thing.
One person trying to make a point is not an activist, they are a$$hats. Just like that guy who wanted to carry a loaded shotgun in DC, film a 5min video a got the hell out of there before the cop showed up.
What gives local governments the right to ignore the constitution? Those are illegal laws. So I guess the men at the Boston Tea Party were just a$$hats then.
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:50 AM   #88
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Preach on RJD.

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Old 09-05-2013, 01:51 AM   #89
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Bingo! You hit the nail on the head as usual sir.



I doubt he'll listen. Like the you tubers he is desperately trying to draw attention to himself and going about it the wrong way for the wrong reasons. I personally think you have summed this all up very nicely. You have a great way of doing this most of the time and I enjoy reading your posts. Keep up the good work!


Why should I listen to left wing BS? Read the constitution and figure it out.
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Old 09-05-2013, 02:00 AM   #90
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Bingo! You hit the nail on the head as usual sir.

I doubt he'll listen. Like the you tubers he is desperately trying to draw attention to himself and going about it the wrong way for the wrong reasons. I personally think you have summed this all up very nicely. You have a great way of doing this most of the time and I enjoy reading your posts. Keep up the good work!
Thanks! I appreciate that. I try to keep a level head as often as possible. That doesn't always happen though (like when talk of looting military installations comes up). For what its worth, I enjoy reading your posts as well, despite my first interaction with you being an extended debate about capacity while carrying a weapon. And actually that was enjoyable too, because it seems like you try to use facts and base your arguments off of those (as well as your own experience) rather than emotion.

..... Bromance? .....

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Why should I listen to left wing BS? Read the constitution and figure it out.
If I'm preaching left wing bullsh*t then you're so far on the right you're practically a neo-nazi. It's hard for me to get much more conservative. You're a fool, have a good day. I'm done with you. Enjoy being a fool.
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