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Old 07-18-2013, 08:03 PM   #81
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When I went through my class here in OK, were told that property crime does not constitute a self defense situation. So if I were to do as you say, and things go south, I could be charged with manslaughter or murder for being the agressor. In this situation, best to call PD and let them handle it. Nothing I own is worth that. Only my family and my life.
Wrong answer. If you witness a crime of any type you have the right to intervene and protect your property, BUT you may only use deadly force for self defense if you have a 'reasonable, articulable fear of serious bodily injury or death'. So to answer your question. I would not advise you to go immediately to the a drawn gun (deadly force), but to approach with a weapon on your person (armed) incase you need to defend yourself, and order the person to leave or ask what he is doing. You do have the right to make a 'citizens arrest' in most jurisdictions, but you can use only 'reasonable and justifiable force' to make this arrest. The problem here is you must be able to articulate what you do and why. In todays world that can be very hard to do. The Martin-Zimmerman incident is a prime example. Zimmerman was 100% right and Martin 100% wrong and we see what happens when the progressives have their way, the the truth is spun 180 degrees.
The point is you do have the right to 'stop' someone from stealing your car but not by shooting them. If you approach and try to stop them and they attack you you can invoke your right of self defence, but they must place you in jeopardy before deadly force is legal!
EVERY one of these incidents MUST be evaluated separately, with an open mind, and the totality of the circumstances considered.
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Old 07-18-2013, 08:19 PM   #82
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Even if you are in a SYG state retreating should be your first option. If you tried to retreat and the attacker pursues you and runs you down you are in the right no matter how any DA tries to twist it.

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Old 07-18-2013, 08:40 PM   #83
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Even if you are in a SYG state retreating should be your first option. If you tried to retreat and the attacker pursues you and runs you down you are in the right no matter how any DA tries to twist it.
You are correct. This is what I teach in my Armed Self Defense Classes. If you can retreat SAFELY do so!!! Shoot outs don't always go your way. In any violent confrontation there is high probability you could be killed or injured, or, even if you are right and survive, you could get 'Zimmermanized' by a progressive prosecutor!!
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Old 07-18-2013, 09:08 PM   #84
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Just to clarify, I don't advocate deadly force in simple property crimes. But, when I come out and yell at the guy to get outta my car and he decides to attack me, or do I sit in my living room and dial 911 while peeking out the window? Or, do I go out already drawn and order the guy to the ground while my wife calls 911 from the living room?

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Old 07-18-2013, 09:11 PM   #85
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Just to clarify, I don't advocate deadly force in simple property crimes. But, when I come out and yell at the guy to get outta my car and he decides to attack me, or do I sit in my living room and dial 911 while peeking out the window? Or, do I go out already drawn and order the guy to the ground while my wife calls 911 from the living room?
That my friend is a decision ONLY you can make!!!!!
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Old 07-18-2013, 09:17 PM   #86
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I know, I'm just attempting to articulate the thought process of defending one's property.

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Old 07-18-2013, 09:31 PM   #87
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I know, I'm just attempting to articulate the thought process of defending one's property.
Roger that!
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Old 07-18-2013, 10:34 PM   #88
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What has not been discussed here is the law,at least as it pertains to Florida,which defends a lawful citizen from the frivolous lawsuits that commonly follow either from the forcible fellon and or their families.

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Old 07-18-2013, 10:52 PM   #89
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Quote:
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I know, I'm just attempting to articulate the thought process of defending one's property.
The law as I read it says
(1)A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:

(a)The person against whomever the defensive force passed was and forcibly entered , a dwelling, residence or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that persons will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and

(b)The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred.
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Old 07-18-2013, 11:24 PM   #90
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Holder can whine, unrinate and complain until the cows come home. The vast majority of states that have "make my day" and "stand your ground" laws will not change them to suit a bunch of anti-self defense, scum loving blissninnies. Folks here in OK like those laws. In the unlikely event the OK legislature messed with either of those laws the citizens of OK would pass them as referendums.

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