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Old 06-21-2013, 10:46 PM   #41
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the laws are different in each state
Not really that different, that's why the it's called "The Uniform Criminal Code", petty much the same in each State. Some states will put you to death for murder some will just lock you up and throw away the key. Make no mistake about it, it is murder no matter how you look at it, justifiable or not.

Tackelbarry is correct, you just unload the gun, put it on the floor and open the door when the police come, tell them you had to do it in self-defense then shut up and wait until your lawyer comes and don't say another word. Anything you say can and WILL be used against you in court.

The police are not there to determine your guilt or innocence, that is up to a jury, but to control the situation and secure the premise and collect evidence and see that no one else is hurt.

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Now if they passed a law about shooting Trick or Treater's I'd vote for that. (LOL)

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In less than one week the county prosecutor gave the lady a pass and charged an accomplice of the late perp with murder:
Give me a break, she kills a known killer that the police are looking for!! Any first year law student could have gotten her off on this case.
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Old 06-21-2013, 11:55 PM   #42
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Give me a break, she kills a known killer that the police are looking for!! Any first year law student could have gotten her off on this case.
BS, man !!!
She did not kill "a known killer that the police were looking for!!" She killed a scumbag who was looking for her late husbands terminal cancer meds. The prosecutor charged the dead scumbags accomplice with murder for the death of his partner in crime. Yep, they do that stuff here in OK. With the very high crime rate in IL cities maybe they should do that there too.

Look; i did not fall of the turnip wagon yesterday. Been there, done that; twice. Both shoots were in the 1960s in a state that is now very anti-self defense and anti-gun. Was not arrested either time. Neither was my wife. We both talked freely with the state police.
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Old 06-22-2013, 11:29 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by txpossum View Post
The answer depends on a lot of different factors, the main ones being the laws of the state where you live, and the policies and practices of the law enforcement agency investigating the shooting.

I was an assistant district attorney in Fort Worth for four years, then was in private practice for almost 20 years, and was board certified by the Texas Board of Legal Specialization in criminal law for most of that time. Criminal law made up about 70% of my caseload. I have done over 300 felony trials,most of them violent crimes. I tried cases over much of Texas.

In most places in Texas, if: (1) you are in your own home; and (2) the intruder is armed, you will probably not be arrested, unless there are unusual circumstances. The weapon will almost always be confiscated while the investigation proceeds, and you will likely need a court order to get it back, even if you are cleared. The case may or may not be presented to a grand jury. In these circumstances you will usually come out allright.

The important thing to tell the cops is that you were afraid for your life, or the life of someone in the house. You did it to prevent death or serious bodily injury to yourself or your loved ones. Do not brag about it; do not say the dead guy deserved it; if fact, say as little as possible until you talk to a lawyer. DO NOT GO INTO THE POLICE STATION TO GIVE A STATEMENT WITHOUT AN ATTORNEY. DO NOT BRAG ABOUT IT TO YOUR FRIENDS-- DO NOT SAY ANYTHING ABOUT IT TO YOUR FRIENDS WHILE THE INVESTIGATION IS PENDING. Do not post about it on Facebook.

If the person turns to run when he sees the gun, do not shoot him when he is fleeing. Let the sucker go.

A shooting is always serious business, and most cops don't have a sense of humor about a dead body. At least not in front of civilians.
I remember that a new law passed in Texas and soon after a man called the police to report two men burglarizing his neighbors home. He tells the dispatcher he's going outside. You hear a shotgun being chambered then 2 shots. Both burglars were killed as they exited the neighbors home. The shooter was not prosecuted because of the new law. I think this happened in the Houston area.
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Old 06-22-2013, 03:42 PM   #44
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IIRC, Canebrake had an excellent sticky about how to

respond after a SD scenario. It was well thought out, and written.

The Gutmacher book says much the same thing.

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Old 06-22-2013, 04:10 PM   #45
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It depends largely on what state you live in and the circumstances surrounding the event.

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Old 06-22-2013, 05:11 PM   #46
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North of the border, a few things Jack may have done to indicate a justified shooting:
Get backed into a wall or corner (no ready means to flee from harms way) also defensable position in case of accomplice.

Ditch the buckshot & load with grouse loads "I just wanted him to stop attacking me". In fact any 12ga load is lethal at 3 paces, and the near closure is another thing in Jacks' favor!
good discussion.

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Old 06-22-2013, 08:44 PM   #47
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North of the border, a few things Jack may have done to indicate a justified shooting:
Get backed into a wall or corner (no ready means to flee from harms way) also defensable position in case of accomplice.

Ditch the buckshot & load with grouse loads "I just wanted him to stop attacking me". In fact any 12ga load is lethal at 3 paces, and the near closure is another thing in Jacks' favor!
good discussion.
'any 12ga load is lethal at 3 paces', not even close!!!

More myth and misinformation!
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Old 06-22-2013, 10:29 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by bigjim View Post
Not really that different, that's why the it's called "The Uniform Criminal Code", petty much the same in each State. Some states will put you to death for murder some will just lock you up and throw away the key. Make no mistake about it, it is murder no matter how you look at it, justifiable or not.

Tackelbarry is correct, you just unload the gun, put it on the floor and open the door when the police come, tell them you had to do it in self-defense then shut up and wait until your lawyer comes and don't say another word. Anything you say can and WILL be used against you in court.

The police are not there to determine your guilt or innocence, that is up to a jury, but to control the situation and secure the premise and collect evidence and see that no one else is hurt.

Jim

Now if they passed a law about shooting Trick or Treater's I'd vote for that. (LOL)



Give me a break, she kills a known killer that the police are looking for!! Any first year law student could have gotten her off on this case.
I agree but would not tell them "I did anything"...

I would tell them "I thought he was going to kill me". Period! That's it.

If indighted... The DA will have all the notes from responding LEO... he will know exactly what you said... He will know exactly what officers will testify as to "what you said"... and he will "word" his questions in a way that looks as damning as possible for the jury.

^^THIS^^ is why you accept the fact that being arrested is going to happen... nothing you say will change that... But anything you say will bite you in the ass!

Tack
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Old 06-22-2013, 10:38 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by molonlabexx
Hey guys. Really happy with this forum and the replies I have gotten and tips! Recently I have been studying NRA gun articles about how people defend themselves and I have a few questions. But first a scenario (please in no way think I am trying to "glorify" home defense. I know things go wrong and it takes a lot, I am simply interested in learning the legal replications) Jack is sleeping in his small ranch house, with a few neighbors around the area. Jack has no felonies, no DUI's or anything on his record, maybe a few speeding tickets here and there. Jack goes to bed and a few hours later, someone breaks into the house. Jack then is prompted to grab his shotgun (OO BUCK, 12 GA). Jack confronts the suspect only to find that he is armed with a tactical knife. Jack yells at the man to halt while he calls the police (calling the police is a MUST because it keeps the question of if you meant to kill the aggressor or not.) With 911 dialed, the aggressor now starts coming at Jack. ordering the aggressor to halt, Jack is running out of distance between him and the aggressor. Jack then fires at the aggressor, fatally stopping him. With 911 on the line, Jack tells them the situation that he thinks the man is dead. Jack secures the area, making sure there are no other aggressors around.

What happens in the days to come? Is your gun taken away from you as evidence after a situation like this? This will give me help in the legal side of being a RESPONSIBLE gun owner. The law is in favor of criminals. Thanks all.
No matter how justified a shooting(killing) is!! You can expect to be inconvenienced for a long time to come from multiple sources!! Every CC or gun owner(HD) should no that before the choose to own and or carry a gun!!
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Old 06-22-2013, 11:56 PM   #50
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Op...

I think it could vary greatly depending upon the jurisdiction. The "hypothetical" your pose has all the hallmarks of a "good shoot"... but once never can quiet tell.

Personally, I would not be worrying about calling 911 until the threat was "neutralized"... and would not call unless there was no one else available to call it in. The only information 911 would get would be my name, address, and the fact that there had been a shooting... then I hang up!

Courts have upheld 911 recordings as evidence to hang "defensive shooters" because they said something stupid like "Your damn right I shot the SOB!" or "Yea, don't bother with EMS, just send the coroner... and Rug Doctor if you got the number."

Adrenalin not only impedes fine motor function... It can also make the most intelligent and controlled person sound like a blood thirsty raving lunatic... and that tape can and will be held against you!

Rule #1 of any defensive shooting is when the Cops arrive... Cooperate with there commands and IGNORE there investigation. They are not there to help you through this, there writing down everything you say... and the adrenalin is still DUMPING into your system so SAY NOTHING other than... "I thought he was going to kill me."

This is very important because you will be asked the same questions multiple times, in different ways, by different people, and any answer that deviates from an earlier answer will be considered a LIE.

If you going to use a gun for self defense, have a lawyer on retainer, or at least make contact with one so you know who to call. Let the lawyer talk to the Police/DA...

Your alive so you've already done your job... Now let the attorney do his.

Tack
Sounds like sound advise to me, pretty much the same as my own attorney told me.
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