[TankTop]

Originally Posted by c3shooter

Sorry- forgot to make an observation-

Since they feel that gun owners are a minority, then he is expressing that only the rights of the MAJORITY are to be preserved. The rights of a MINORITY are.... unimportant? Immaterial?

Rather cheesy attitude there...........

Actually that is the very reason we have a bill of rights, so that the majority cannot vote away the rights of the minority.

[ScottA]

That first post just simply didn't make any sense. He's got you running down a bunny trail that has nothing to do with the issue.

[Jpyle]

Agreed, your friend is engaging in an Alinsky type method that sets up a straw man argument that most NRA members are rural, white, conservative, uneducated Bible thumpers ( sound familiar) then sets about to argue how they are out of step with emerging demographics of the country AND he sets up gun ownership as being equivalent to being a slave owner. He of course has no facts to support this conclusion but I am sure he would spout the same horse**** to describe the Tea Party, a lie that has been dispelled in print numerous times.

The objective of this style of dishonest argument is to invent a fictitious opponent and present that opponent to the general population as being worthy of ridicule, persecution and eventual elimination from society. Hitler did it with the Jews, Stalin did it with the Ukraine, Pol Pot did it with Cambodia, now the left is trying it against gun owners, conservatives in general will be next. Google Cynthia Chase in New Hampshire.

Just a couple of observations:

Your friend compares the NRA membership to the entire US population, not to the adult population...kinda dishonest.

His list "contributors" includes millionaires. Well millionaire is not an occupation, what if the millionaire made his money selling guns?

[Vikingdad]

More from him. I am no longer going to protect his identity. Have at him if you like. I am getting worn down. It should be known here that he is a recent immigrant from France.

Karim Khaldi We can always find exceptions, but the statistics are what matters. Women, black, liberals, independents, Hispanics, engineers, teachers, ... are generally in favor of gun control. And that demography is waxing.
Gun supporters are generally white, male, republican, low ed, low income. And that demography is waning.

Yes, I am sure we can find an affluent democrat doctor who supports the NRA, but it's like finding a needle in a hay stack, not a stack of needles.

The bottom line is that more than 50% of adult Americans want gun control. And virtually 100% of kids too
54 minutes ago via mobile · Like
Karim Khaldi Regarding the NRA membership vs. influence:
. I certainly wish the Unions would have the same relative influence as the gun lobby.
. NPR has way more members and listeners, but no lobbying power.
. Organizations fighting for the earth, against GMO, ....See More
47 minutes ago via mobile · Like
Karim Khaldi Another important demographic group are emigrants. Virtually all of them are against guns. Why?

- The ones coming from third world countries have had first hand experience with guns and reject violence.
- The ones coming from industrialized countries bring a progressive culture with them.

The US is a strange mix. The only industrialized country with homicide, violence and incarceration rates greater than many 3rd world countries.

This is an anomaly that most emigrant want to change. And it will change.
36 minutes ago via mobile · Like

[TankTop]

Enough said, you just can't fix stupid

[Vikingdad]

Check this out- just tonight.

(Karim Khaldi) Dude seriously, why don't you move to AZ, or KY, if you like their politics better? You will soon realize the Bay Area is a great place because we do things differently here. We believe in freedom, peace and progress. And the result is clear, the Bay Area is one of the main forces driving this country. If you wanna be stuck in the 19th century, there are plenty of backward states you can go to, with backward social and economical prospects. So, try that please: go live in another state for a few years. I bet you will come back to the Bay Area lauding Obama and you will support the repeal of 2A. But if you want to stay in the Bay Area you gotta release the parking brake and get up to speed and join the 21st century.
about an hour ago · Like


(Vikingdad) Karim, I could just as easily invite you to go back to France, but I won't. It first of all would not be polite, and secondly is uncalled for. You profess to want to stand up for minorities yet from the other side of your mouth you invite me, a political minority if you will, to leave because of my beliefs. Bad form my friend.

ZING!!

[Jpyle]

Originally Posted by Vikingdad

Check this out- just tonight.



ZING!!

And by bad form I mean F*&k you. Your friend is unfortunately sounding like an obnoxious ******* who doesn't have time for the unsophisticates in fly over country. He has his head up his azz and is convinced of his own moral superiority.

[Vikingdad]

But wait! There's more! These posts were stacked with no response by me in between)

Karim Khaldi It's for your own good. We could call it a "field study" or a "research". I believe in the power of experience, and I think there is great value in looking at how things are elsewhere. Again, I am sure that if you were to go to AZ or KY you would change your mind about certain topics and you would be grateful and more appreciative for the good things we have here in the Bay Area. Good things don't come for free, and there is a link between the quality of living we enjoy, and the politics and social programs we have voted for. The Bay Area is successful because it is progressive and peaceful. The Bay Area would not be as successful if we had more guns.
11 minutes ago · Edited · Like
Karim Khaldi When I travel to Europe, I disseminate some of the good things I have acquired/learned in the US. No one in Europe has ever told me I should "go back to the US" when my views are different from there. This "go away" thing is childish. That's what kids say when they are not able to talk through. We are adults and we gain from exchanging ideas from different cultures/background. In this particular debate, we would gain by looking at the other industrialized nation. All of them recognize the metric system, all of them have banned death penalty, and none of them have anything like the 2A.
5 minutes ago · Like
Karim Khaldi We gotta stop thinking the US is a supernatural superhero country, which defies the laws of gravity, and is made of a different stuff than other countries. It makes sense to look at how our peers are doing and share best practices.

My response (and then I am going to bed)

(Vikingdad) Karim, I have traveled extensively all over a large part of this country. I love all of it. I continue to live here not because of the politics but in spite of them. I was born and raised here. Now cut with the elitist and condescending crap like "its for your own good." I could just as easily say that the Second Amendment is "for your own good", but that would be condescending and I wouldn't stoop to that level. You were the one who invited me to "go away", I did not. I was the one who said it was bad form for you to say it.

[Vikingdad]

Another insane rant from Karim:

Karim Khaldi commented on your link.
Karim wrote: "Gun owners and guns are not inherently evil. They are dangerous. We need to regulate them. Every modern country regulate guns. 100%. Owning a gun does not make you a criminal, but it increases the risk. If you don't know how to use a gun, you have zero risk of becoming a mass shooter. 100% of mass shooters have guns. Having guns places you into the population group of gun owners. This population group is the one from which mass shooters are coming from. There is no simple rule explaining how someone becomes a criminal. It is not a matter of time, it is not a matter of birth or skin color. It is more complex. But it happens, and anyone is susceptible of become a criminal. Let's make an (unrelated) analogy. Not every apple have an apple-worm, but some apples do. If you don't eat any apple, you have no chance to get an apple worm. If you eat an apple, you increases your risk of getting an apple-worm. If you want to regulate the worms, regulate the apples. I know, that's not a great analogy, just a simplification."

I would like to have a contest on the best response to this. But perhaps it would be silence.

[Mosin]

Originally Posted by Vikingdad

Another insane rant from Karim:

I would like to have a contest on the best response to this. But perhaps it would be silence.

Every modern country doesn't have a constitution guaranteeing an uninfringed right to bear arms....
Bye...