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From the mouth of the beast its self: we will ban your firearms if reelected


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Old 09-05-2012, 09:14 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by AIKIJUTSU View Post
"Firearms. We recognize that the individual right to bear arms is an important part of the American tradition, and we will preserve Americans' Second Amendment right to own and use firearms. We believe that the right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation. We understand the terrible consequences of gun violence; it serves as a reminder that life is fragile, and our time here is limited and precious. We believe in an honest, open national conversation about firearms. We can focus on effective enforcement of existing laws, especially strengthening our background check system, and we can work together to enact commonsense improvements—like reinstating the assault weapons ban and closing the gun show loophole—so that guns do not fall into the hands of those irresponsible, law-breaking few."

There is more to this than meets the eye - if they ban "assault weapons", they can repeatedly redifine what an assault weapon is, all the way down to a Raven .22 if they wish. Maybe even a pea-shooter or a rubber band. That's why the 2A says "shall not be infringed". If banning certain kinds of "arms" is not infringing, what is it?

I agree with you, it IS an infringement. The same infringement can apply to the lists of people that cannot own firearms...The list of "mentally ill" can be expanded to someone who went to a shrink to discuss a marital problem, or a vet who has trouble re-acclimating to civilian life and took it upon him/herself to talk with someone. It leaves tons of room for interpretation and undoubtedly they will try to put as many people on that list as possible but...

The point I bring up is that they hit their constituency with this same dog and pony show 4 years ago, and did NOTHING...Were any of these topics even discussed on the floor of the House/Senate? If they were, I can't remember hearing about it. And if they were discussed, the motions didn't get too far because none of what they complain about has changed one bit.

I have to think, if the purging of the Dems continues like in 2010, in the House/Senate, why is there anything to worry about? POTUS can't executive order his way into his desired dictatorship...I'm sure it won't stop him from trying but it ain't gonna work...
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Old 09-05-2012, 09:48 PM   #32
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Massachusetts has some of the strictest gun laws on the books. Who's watch did that happen under? Mitt Romney! I can't tell who is worse Obama or Romney. Let a republican president with an anti-gun agenda bring an assault weapon ban before a republican congress and see what happens. The assault weapon ban will pass and the republicans will celebrate their success.

Right now medicine is eating up 18% of our gross national product. Romney will strip the eighth amendment of it's power. The first amendment has already been stripped. Do you think our forefathers would have got a permit to assemble and air their grievances? In the south Jim Crowe laws were used to arrest and disperse the occupiers. Everyone thinks it's funny because the occupiers were liberals. I don't think any abuse of the constitution is funny. What was done to the liberals will be done to us. What was done to the blacks will be done to everyone. The laws are already on the books. All it will take is someone who thinks it's "needed"
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Old 09-05-2012, 09:52 PM   #33
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Are you saying you think there will be one in the new legislation? That's optimistic.

What it they "grandfather" your evil ARs provisionally: you must register them?
I love you man, but sometimes that big brain of yours goes well into the deep end of the pool and I don't think I can swim out there.

There isn't a way to force registration on the half a billion weapons that have changed hands through inheritence or face to face sale, so without a grandfather clause an AWB can't work as a unilateral offensive move.

We come back to HOW?

You can't. You can restrict the ammo. You can restrict the sale of said weapons. You can restrict the production of parts.

But there is no magical record of all the parts that have already been sold.

As for myself I bought one complete AR in my lifetime. That AR is now in two places. The upper went to a former member on the east coast and the lower was used in a build that was sold to another person here locally.

Now I currently have receivers on the books, but that is all I would have to produce, a receiver. There is no way anyone at the Universal Gun Command Center of Confiscation is going to be able to say I built this, or that, out of a receiver.

I bring in a receiver that has been stripped and given a fresh coat of paint, there you go. That matches the paperwork you have on me.

IF I was feeling scared for my life and CHOSE to turn it in to them in the first place. Which ranks up there with going to the dentist and getting a penile swab done.

As I have stated a thousand times. You can make a receiver out of a lot of common materials that can be found at Home Depot. Even laminated hard wood with a box of razor blades, a chisel, some glue and some patience.

I have a diagram if anyone wants a copy with all the dimensions too, just in case.

You can restrict sales, but you can't possibly confiscate what you don't know exists.

And then we have the bolt gun issue. Having all the AR's and AK's in the world can't possibly match what one determined person can do with a good bolt gun and a half a box of shells.
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Old 09-05-2012, 09:58 PM   #34
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Reasonable Regulation = Giant Shrimp

From the mouth of the beast its self:  we will ban your firearms if reelected - Legal and Activism
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:03 PM   #35
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All this talk is making me think it is finally time to buy my first AR.
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:04 PM   #36
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I saw it coming and traded half of what was in my safe to get mine asap.
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:16 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
I love you man, but sometimes that big brain of yours goes well into the deep end of the pool and I don't think I can swim out there.

There isn't a way to force registration on the half a billion weapons that have changed hands through inheritence or face to face sale, so without a grandfather clause an AWB can't work as a unilateral offensive move.

We come back to HOW?

You can't. You can restrict the ammo. You can restrict the sale of said weapons. You can restrict the production of parts.

But there is no magical record of all the parts that have already been sold.

As for myself I bought one complete AR in my lifetime. That AR is now in two places. The upper went to a former member on the east coast and the lower was used in a build that was sold to another person here locally.

Now I currently have receivers on the books, but that is all I would have to produce, a receiver. There is no way anyone at the Universal Gun Command Center of Confiscation is going to be able to say I built this, or that, out of a receiver.

I bring in a receiver that has been stripped and given a fresh coat of paint, there you go. That matches the paperwork you have on me.

IF I was feeling scared for my life and CHOSE to turn it in to them in the first place. Which ranks up there with going to the dentist and getting a penile swab done.

As I have stated a thousand times. You can make a receiver out of a lot of common materials that can be found at Home Depot. Even laminated hard wood with a box of razor blades, a chisel, some glue and some patience.

I have a diagram if anyone wants a copy with all the dimensions too, just in case.

You can restrict sales, but you can't possibly confiscate what you don't know exists.

And then we have the bolt gun issue. Having all the AR's and AK's in the world can't possibly match what one determined person can do with a good bolt gun and a half a box of shells.
It's not about what's possible, but about the definition of "legal". While they can't hope to register those dreaded assault rifles, would you comply or not?

Put a little differently, would you choose to become a criminal or would you comply with the law?

Again, no one needs to answer that. Just figure it out yourself ahead of time.

You have *nothing* on the books. A 4473 means nothing.

And they can't restrict the sale of anything. The government has proven that in their war on drugs, booze prohibition, and common gang jackwagons who can get guns fast and cheap. So I'm not worried about that.

If your dentist is doing penile swabs you should probably look for a new dentist. Just sayin'....
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:17 PM   #38
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Reasonable Regulation = Giant Shrimp
Exactly. There's no such thing.
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:26 PM   #39
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We'd be f'd here over the pond too if they reinstate the AWB. It's hard enough trying to get ARs nowadays because you guys are buying all of them

On a more serious note, all the stuff the lefties are trying to achieve there, we pretty much already have here and we still have school shootings and other sorts of gun violence. Registration, licensing, all that bs has not stopped the criminals and maniacs doing what they do. It's amazing how people can't get it into their heads that no law or regulation will stop the bad guys. A year ago or so, Estonia started issuing CCW permits and their crime rates went down. Yet in Finland the left is screaming how we have lax gun laws and most guns per capita (this part is actually not even true) in Europe. They refuse to see the real problem which is too little money put into mental health care and too short prison sentences. I find it amusing how the lefties in the US say that the 2nd Amendment is outdated and the world has changed from the days when it was written and thus not needed. They're correct that the world has changed, it's much more violent with ever more arrogant criminals who have no respect for other peoples property or lives.
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:36 PM   #40
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Folks, back up and look at this from the Democrats point of view:

There is nothing in the world that the Democrats could do or say to influence a great majority of the members of this forum to vote for Obama. Period.

Therefore with this plank, they have nothing to lose here. The average gun forum/NRA member has been written off. They have made the calculation that this plank will speak to their people and maybe influence the few in the middle that will decide this election. This should not be news, it is consistant with their position since Bill Clinton.

With the recent gun violence commited by crazy people, with assualt weapons, a lot of people just do not see the need for you and I to have high-capacity, removable magazine, semi-automatic rifles and there is nothing you can do to change their minds..........
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