[Murfdeezy]

Originally Posted by ScottG

You wanted it, you got it.... The rest of the story.

Now what do you all think?

This just infuriates me more, but the article was well written. He is right. We should look at any law that would allow behavior even remotely similar to what happened to that poor man. All people involved should absolutely be held accountable. Clearly they all lost their freakin minds.......so maybe we should take their guns, you know, pending a non voluntary mental health evaluation. Just a thought.

[operator0]

Originally Posted by Dillinger

All I am saying is that IF it was a violation of this individuals rights, he is probably NEVER going to have to work again.

But IF the police involvement just saved some lives of people in a work place shooting, then this intervention is in ALL of our interests as LAWFUL gun owners....

JD

Who decides that he's "disgruntled"? What would those decisions lead to if, in 30 years, they become acceptable? That's incredibly dangerous ground you and some others who've replied are traveling, Dillinger.

The liberties that this country were founded on were carefully considered. It was the opinion of the founding fathers that even though terrible things may happen because of the right to privacy, it's an incredibly important check against those who wish to use the government to achieve incredible power and apply tyranny against it's subjects.

My opinion is that he may well have used those guns to shoot his co-workers or others. That's a small price to pay for the eventual alternative if the right to privacy and right against false imprisonment aren't adhered to more stringently.

The same applies to some of the provisions in the Patriot Act. Has the Patriot Act reduced the number of terror attacks in this country? Probably. But I would honestly rather see another 9/11 than give the government powers that have historically lead to the oppression of it's people. And that's what would happen. History has proved it in every instance.

[diggsbakes]

Originally Posted by operator0

Who decides that he's "disgruntled"? What would those decisions lead to if, in 30 years, they become acceptable? That's incredibly dangerous ground you and some others who've replied are traveling, Dillinger.

My opinion is that he may well have used those guns to shoot his co-workers or others. That's a small price to pay for the eventual alternative if the right to privacy and right against false imprisonment aren't adhered to more stringently.

Slow down there Tonto. Like previously stated, if this man had to plans to commit any wrongdoing to his former co-workers, then he's gonna be one fat cat. If he was gonna smoke a roomful of folks that had nothing to do with his dismissal and take them away from their families, then it's for the better.

So should the U.S. government abide by the same standard if they receive intel regarding a potential terrorist attack? Just let it happen, then go after the people responsible, because it would be a violation of civil rights to interfere with those individuals before hand?

Humans often act upon gut instinct in certain situations. If you're right you're a hero, if you're wrong you're a criminal. Oh well. . . the guy probably struck gold on this one. I'd definitely be willing to go through a forced psych exam for a mil or 2.

[operator0]

Argues for sport

[Dillinger]

Originally Posted by operator0

Who decides that he's "disgruntled"? What would those decisions lead to if, in 30 years, they become acceptable? That's incredibly dangerous ground you and some others who've replied are traveling, Dillinger.

That has been defined, and re-defined by your president Klinton and several other folks with WAY too much power.

Quite frankly if a person ( regardless of sex, race, age, color, creed or monetary worth ) makes statements about hating his co-workers, wishing them harm, stalking from cubicle to cubicle with a gas powered, magazine fed weapon or that someone "will regret this" - I fully expect someone to look further into this situation and I don't give a good god damn what YOU think.

One saved innocent life is worth several thousand dollars in "settlement" dollars.

If you doubt this, you need to spend some time with the victims of 09/11 or Virginia Tech.

Originally Posted by operator0

My opinion is that he may well have used those guns to shoot his co-workers or others. That's a small price to pay for the eventual alternative if the right to privacy and right against false imprisonment aren't adhered to more stringently.

This statement disqualifies you from discussion on this topic. No matter what "perceived" Right has been stepped on, it is not worth more than the life of one innocent person.

If you doubt this, take a look at the provisional settlements paid to people who have settled out of court versus the pain of ONE mother losing a child who did nothing wrong.

Originally Posted by operator0

The same applies to some of the provisions in the Patriot Act. Has the Patriot Act reduced the number of terror attacks in this country? Probably. But I would honestly rather see another 9/11 than give the government powers that have historically lead to the oppression of it's people. And that's what would happen. History has proved it in every instance.

If you would advocate another 09/11, then you are no friend of this forum and you need to reconsider our "online persona".

JD

[doctherock]

Originally Posted by Dillinger

That has been defined, and re-defined by your president Klinton and several other folks with WAY too much power.

Quite frankly if a person ( regardless of sex, race, age, color, creed or monetary worth ) makes statements about hating his co-workers, wishing them harm, stalking from cubicle to cubicle with a gas powered, magazine fed weapon or that someone "will regret this" - I fully expect someone to look further into this situation and I don't give a good god damn what YOU think.

One saved innocent life is worth several thousand dollars in "settlement" dollars.

If you doubt this, you need to spend some time with the victims of 09/11 or Virginia Tech.





This statement disqualifies you from discussion on this topic. No matter what "perceived" Right has been stepped on, it is not worth more than the life of one innocent person.

If you doubt this, take a look at the provisional settlements paid to people who have settled out of court versus the pain of ONE mother losing a child who did nothing wrong.



If you would advocate another 09/11, then you are no friend of this forum and you need to reconsider our "online persona".

JD

Dillinger would you like a hug? My wife would be more than willing to give you one. Just messin with you. This could have gone so many ways, difference is we had intel on 9/11 that people in the government failed to listen too. Pearl harbor had the same happen, someone said hey its hitting the fan and the gubment disagreed. Money, greed, politics, hate all lead up to these violent circumstances. Hard to say what could or could not have happened with this one. Hope he don't take it to court though my taxes in Oregon are high enough......

[Murfdeezy]

Originally Posted by diggsbakes

Slow down there Tonto. Like previously stated, if this man had to plans to commit any wrongdoing to his former co-workers, then he's gonna be one fat cat. If he was gonna smoke a roomful of folks that had nothing to do with his dismissal and take them away from their families, then it's for the better.

So should the U.S. government abide by the same standard if they receive intel regarding a potential terrorist attack? Just let it happen, then go after the people responsible, because it would be a violation of civil rights to interfere with those individuals before hand?

Humans often act upon gut instinct in certain situations. If you're right you're a hero, if you're wrong you're a criminal. Oh well. . . the guy probably struck gold on this one. I'd definitely be willing to go through a forced psych exam for a mil or 2.

I am all for more heros. I would not give up another 4000 American lives, unless it was necessary to save 40000 American lives. Those are decisions that are deep in the grey area, and everyone hopes they never have to make. However, it is required of certain individuals because of the title they hold. I don't envy them for that. That being said, this was all wrong. I don't believe in giving up constitutional rights for any reason. You can't have my guns, because that privelege was carefully thought out, before it was given. All of our constitutional rights were. We are a country of revolutionaries, or terrorists, depending on who you ask. Our founding fathers saw the progression of their own government, the power they eventually attained, and the betrayal and oppression of their own people that eventually ensued. The constitution was a document intended to protect us from ourselves, not anyone else, because human nature will ultimately prevail in almost all cases. We should never trust our government any more than you would trust a stranger. Be friendly, but be wary as well. Not everything they tell you is true. The sad part is that this country is on a dangerous path to come full circle to the oppressive country in a very short period of time. I love America, and I have been abroad and seen many other places as well. There are a few other places that I would not mind living. We were a great country, we are not so great right now, but I believe we can be great again. There are regulations and laws in place for situations like this one. There are checks and balances, warrrants, probable cause, judicial oversight, etc. that were blatently ignored in an effort to circumvent the system and target this individual for whatever reason. It is not really important why, the fact is it was done, and it is a big deal if it is not squashed. Sometimes they push a little to see if you will take it, then a little more, until you don't know you have been had. Kind of like not noticing your son got so tall because you see him everyday, but to others it is obvious. We should always be wary. We should also be willing to help fight for our freedoms, and to rebuild if necessary.....not just complain. Sometimes we gotta not like what we see in the mirror in order to fix it. Noticing there is something wrong is the first step. That is just my opinion, but I feel very strongly about these things. It is part of my character, union backround, and military. I am not liberal, or conservative, democrat or republican, religious or agnostic. I am just a guy that believes that we were given some very carefully selected priveleges by people much more intelligent, and concerned, than those that attempt to take them away. We should never take them for granted, but we also should make every effort to be responsible enough to deserve them. Both sides have idiots that ruin everything. It is never personal with me. These guys just blew it. If it happened out here in New England, it would be on all the news channels 24-7. Just ironic. Thanks for listening to me rant. Stay strong. Stay humble. Stay.....employed. haha.

BTW Diggs, this was not directed at you specifically. It was kind of a response to the posts preceding yours as well. It just kind of built up and I ended up responding to you. Nothing personal. Sorry if it came accross that way.

[BILLYBOB44]

Originally Posted by Gatekeeper

It is income tax season, lots of large purchases this time of year.
just sayin', possibility

That's my thought too Gate. During these slow times I have sold some hand loaded bullets. Does the Feds. need to flag me for multi powder/primer purchases?? I hope not.......

[Murfdeezy]

Originally Posted by doctherock

Dillinger would you like a hug? My wife would be more than willing to give you one. Just messin with you. This could have gone so many ways, difference is we had intel on 9/11 that people in the government failed to listen too. Pearl harbor had the same happen, someone said hey its hitting the fan and the gubment disagreed. Money, greed, politics, hate all lead up to these violent circumstances. Hard to say what could or could not have happened with this one. Hope he don't take it to court though my taxes in Oregon are high enough......

hahaha. Maybe if this country offered justice instead of cash, we would be better off.....both morally, and financially. I won't hold my breath for a solution today though........so..........good luck with your taxes. haha.

[doctherock]

Originally Posted by BILLYBOB44

That's my thought too Gate. During these slow times I have sold some hand loaded bullets. Does the Feds. need to flag me for multi powder/primer purchases?? I hope not.......

thats it now im gonna have to call ghost busters