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Old 01-24-2013, 03:15 AM   #31
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I don't recall hearing, did Lanza's mother have a safe? If she did it didn't stop the kid from getting the guns out of it, my may have known the combination, I do recall hearing the mother took the kid shooting as she thought it would be beneficial to him to practice and be good at shooting. Besides that if someone is willing to kill to get a weapon they are probably also willing to take 5 minutes with a reciprocating saw and metal blade and get what they want out of the safe, unless you spend top dollar on a safe it isn't going to stop someone who really wants to get in and has time to work at it. A lot of folks around here have safes and gun cabinets with key locks, most all kids around here who are old enough to hunt have the combo or know where the key is. These are typical pointless liberal laws trying to legislate commonsense.

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Old 01-24-2013, 03:16 AM   #32
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I don't disagree with the philosophy you all share about our freedom under the 2nd ammendment
Not sure I would call what we have a philosophy.
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Old 01-24-2013, 03:52 PM   #33
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I guess I'm just tired of hearing about these shootings involving families that should have done a better job keeping their firearms away from unstable, irresponsible, or immature family members. Even that nut-job in that Portland shopping mall stole an AR from his "friend" and used it to kill 3 people. His friend should have done a better job securing his lethal equipment. Lucky there was a ccw citizen there to interupt his plans to kill more.

I guess i'm also just frustrated by irresponsibility
You can't legislate people into being truly responsible. You can legislate minimum requirements, but some people will ignore that legislation. I won't sleep with my shotgun in the safe to comply with some law or the vague intent of some law. Legislating minimum requirements does infringe on the 2nd Amendment to an extent, IMO.

What you can legislate is consequences for failures of judgement. If the Ahole in CT hadn't already killed his mother, she should be facing some charges for leaving firearms within reach of a very unbalanced person and having the forseeable tragedy occur. I think that is as far as it should ever go, not to the point of charging the victim of a firearms theft if that firearm is misused by an unforseeable thief turned murderer.
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Old 01-24-2013, 05:00 PM   #34
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^^^^^^^
We have similar laws to this pertaining to gun storage, they don't require you to buy anything or do anything, they just allow for severe punishment to the gun owner who stores their gun in an unsafe way and a child gets it and shoots someone or theirself. It is the gun owners responsibility to use common sense to avoid the consequences

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Old 01-25-2013, 05:40 AM   #35
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^^^^^^^
We have similar laws to this pertaining to gun storage, they don't require you to buy anything or do anything, they just allow for severe punishment to the gun owner who stores their gun in an unsafe way and a child gets it and shoots someone or theirself. It is the gun owners responsibility to use common sense to avoid the consequences
Yea, but too many don't use common sense; they are the ones that show-up on the evening news. Too many have a cavalier cowboy attitude about their guns it and it's someday going to be the downfall of our 2nd amendment rights. Maybe we could start on our own without government intervention. Maybe the NRA should make our memberships conditional on showing that we store our firearms in a safe manner. Nancy Lanza would have flunked that test, the New Mexico Pastor that got his family killed would have flunked too. So would that bone-head in Portland that allowed his AR to be stolen by his friend.

We can jaw-jaw all night about our rights, what about our responsibilities?
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:54 AM   #36
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The point is they can pass all the laws they want, it doesn't do any good, for example, pass a law that says you have to buy a safe, well ok I will buy a safe, and take it home and fill it with jewelry, cash, important papers, etc. and still keep my gun in my nightstand, what good does this law do? Or a better example, they buy a safe so they can show their receipt and get their guns and they turn around and sell the safe to a buddy to get their money back or 1 guy buys a safe and passes the reciept off throughout a group of friends so they can all get their pass to buy their guns. See what I mean, the law is useless it is just another piece of feel good legislation passed by a bunch of wannabe somebodys to make themselves look good when in reality they did nothing. The right to own a gun is exactly that, a right, not a priviledge graced upon you by the state, they have no business making laws which make it harder for a person to exercise that right.

Why is it so many people from California will complain about the obnoxious gun laws in their state yet they are advocates for even more restrictive, useless, and often unenforcible laws?

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Old 01-25-2013, 08:38 AM   #37
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How do you prove you have a safe? People have to come to your house? Show them a picture? A receipt?
If you are "caught" with a gun do you have to let LEO into see your storage?
Just to give you an idea how it could work if your unlucky. In England we have to renue our firearms cert. Every 5 years where an officer checks your safe can't be pulled off the wall, and that the safe is big enough to hold all of the guns on your cert. He then checks all serial numbers against those on your cert. There can be random inspection's but they tend not to happen. They are not foolproof however since there is no specific requirement to where you store your safe key's.

Friends of mine have had there guns stolen because the burgler s found keys in a drawer!

The police did not take any action against the gun owner.

Even though the guns are registered they still have not been recovered!
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Old 01-25-2013, 08:41 AM   #38
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Yea, but too many don't use common sense; they are the ones that show-up on the evening news. Too many have a cavalier cowboy attitude about their guns it and it's someday going to be the downfall of our 2nd amendment rights. Maybe we could start on our own without government intervention. Maybe the NRA should make our memberships conditional on showing that we store our firearms in a safe manner. Nancy Lanza would have flunked that test, the New Mexico Pastor that got his family killed would have flunked too. So would that bone-head in Portland that allowed his AR to be stolen by his friend.

We can jaw-jaw all night about our rights, what about our responsibilities?
Our responsibilities to whom? While Its a good Idea to lock up your toys when your not using them, its not any type of assurance your kid or someone elses wont hurt someone. Do you lock up your car keys, the steak knives, the Fuel can, Propane tank, your fertilizer, baseball bats, etc, etc? No, probably not and if the kid took the family car and rammed a schoolbus, we wouldnt be saying "Its the parents fault", we would blame the wheelman as we should.

Me and my buddies used to take my moms car when she wasnt home (I was about 12), she found out and started chaining the thing to the garage door opener railing. I got out my handy crescent wrench and took the bolts out of the garage door track and down the road we would go! The only thing that stopped me was when we were joy riding once, the damn accelerator cable broke about 3 miles from home, It was a VW Bug so my buddy rode on the back with the bonnet open and operated the throttle from the back and we got it back home. My mom was evil angry and I paid severely with my ass, never did it again!

Not locking your weapons isnt an action, its the lack of one that is a choice not a legitimate useful rule! I grew up with an attic full of swords without blade locks on them yet they killed nobody and put no one at risk except me and my buddies if we were stupid enough to get caught touching them, can you say asswhoopin?!

Im not saying the parents of these freaks did good, I just have never seen any proof that they caused anything other than the birth of their little freak! They just failed to prevent something they didnt forsee, thats a tragedy but not a felony! Hindsight is 20/20 so now were gonna legitimize mandatory hindsight as a legal strategy? The list of shoulda, coulda and woulda's are endless and useless. If we can suppose a gunsafe could prevent something like this, why cant we suppose the kid would have found another method of getting it done if the Guns were locked, these kids are mental not stupid?

Back to my first question near the beginning of the OP's thread- where does the gunsafe go when Im living in a tent in the woods or do I just relinquish my Rights if I dont own a proper home with locked doors and a Man Cave? Maybe the laws could take everything into account but I think the possibilities are far too endless to invoke Hindsight Law as the cure for a human hell bent on hurting others!
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