If they come for your guns, do you have a responsibility to fight? - Page 19
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Old 02-10-2013, 08:18 PM   #181
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First i am not a fan of registration of firearms and i don't think it will happen in America any more than it has already. My point is directed at the ones posting that there would be mass protests and civil disobedience etc. That in some states registration has already happened and tighter gun controls have already happened. Without the mass protests and civil disobedience predicted so why do they think things would be different now if tighter controls were introduced.
Because..."all power not expressly granted to the federal government is reserved to the States and the People."

I'm begining to think reading comprehension is not your strong suit Manta.

Their is a very big difference between a State ban that can easilly be avoided and a Federal ban/registry that can not.

It is true that most will avoid conflict for as long as it is avoidable.

A federal registry would not be avoidable and givng an American an ultimatum between kneeling or prison is a very good way to get shot.

Tack
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Old 02-10-2013, 08:37 PM   #182
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[/QUOTE]Because..."all power not expressly granted to the federal government is reserved to the States and the People."[/quote]

All that says to me is that even tough the federal government has not required tighter firearm controls. Some states and the people have introduced them anyway. Doesn't really back up your argument of mass protests and civil disobedience. PS Is it only federal controls you have a problem with.

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I'm begining to think reading comprehension is not your strong suit Manta
I will do my best but you are obviously much more intelligent than me.
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Old 02-10-2013, 08:59 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by manta

First i am not a fan of registration of firearms and i don't think it will happen in America any more than it has already. My point is directed at the ones posting that there would be mass protests and civil disobedience etc. That in some states registration has already happened and tighter gun controls have already happened. Without the mass protests and civil disobedience predicted so why do they think things would be different now if tighter controls were introduced.

You don't see the fact that tighter gun controls have happened in some states that it could happen in others.

That statement implies that as long as it doesn't affect you in Washington state that's OK.
Okay. Got ya. Well personally I can see how local/state legislation would not incite protests/civil unrest due to the simple fact that for years those places have been identified as not being gun friendly. You can't really be surprised that in those places (CA, NY) stricter gun control laws are being enacted. Of course this is happening in other places than the examples listed above and being proposed in others. I think when it becomes an issue at the Federal/nationwide level is when it would lead to civil unrest, etc. However I do find it unlikely when you have states such as Alabama that are passing legislation to the contrary. These states will be unlikely to follow any Federal pushes for legislation making gun registration mandatory.
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Old 02-10-2013, 09:04 PM   #184
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IFC

You are correct about the ability to amend the constitution... And if liberals want to abolish the 2nd Ammendment, they should try to do it through this, "the constitutional" process.

I am constantly hearing from folks like Manta who base their notions on US gun laws on what they read from the US MSM... which is laughably inaccurate.

I get particularly irritated with foreign commentators who display their ignorance by quoting a NY or Illinois law and assuming that law impacts me in Washington State...

Our friend Manta strikes me as a fellow who's intensely embarrassed by the shameful and cowardly manner in which he and his fellow subject kneeled before their government and justifies that weakness by trying to convince himself that Americans will do the same... When our time comes.

It's pathetically weak behavior and bellow my standards for acceptable debate.

Tack
Now come on Tack, that smacks of arrogance I am sure your not that guy!

No debate is beneath us we should always respect an alternative view.

Hell guys like you and axxe have changed a lot of my opinion on gun ownership in America. You have challenged my views and I have soul searched alot. I came to the conclusion I had deeply been influenced by my gov and media.

As a gun owner in England I have always disliked and regretted our lack of challenge on our restrictions.

But your country is still young and we have had more battles than you can shake a stick at. It just takes a lot more for us to get riled up.

We are more accepting in this period of our history.

That being said a lot of it is down to misinformation and propaganda and it's only with speaking and debating with are friends like you guys that we get perspective.

We are not going to agree on everything but we can influence eachother through good reasoning. If we become over agressive in our arguments it closes people down and that just ain't healthy.
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Old 02-10-2013, 09:25 PM   #185
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Hell guys like you and axxe have changed a lot of my opinion on gun ownership in America. You have challenged my views and I have soul searched alot. I came to the conclusion I had deeply been influenced by my gov and media.
I would agree debates on this forum have made me look at the way i think about firearm laws and controls in the uk. Unfortunately i think it is already to late to get back what we have lost regards firearms in the uk.
Maybe you will have better luck in America. By getting politicians on board and other peaceful means. I don't think talk of revolution civil war etc is helpful. It will just make Americans that don't have a view one way or another come down on the side of gun control. The thought of guns in the hands of people with them sorts of views would concern a lot of Americans more than further gun controls like it or not.
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Old 02-10-2013, 09:30 PM   #186
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We are more accepting in this period of our history.
Yeah, were are not.

Our 2A and those defending it may very well be saving the few liberties that Brits cling to. Implications go beyond our shores.

Food for thought.
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Old 02-10-2013, 09:59 PM   #187
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Actually... I am "that" guy... Not something I'm proud of... but it is what it is.

My life has always been governed by honor... and doing the right thing regardless of who may be watching... or not watching.

The notion of accepting a ban on... or registration of... products I bought legally with money I earned honestly... after having served my Country honorably... Because a politician no longer trusts me with them?

I'm sorry, but what a politician trusts or does not trust is of no consequence to me or the manner in which I lead my life.

I will continue to do what I do, own what I own, and live my life the way I see fit... and god help the man who says otherwise...

Tack

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Originally Posted by lfcshooter View Post
Now come on Tack, that smacks of arrogance I am sure your not that guy!

No debate is beneath us we should always respect an alternative view.

Hell guys like you and axxe have changed a lot of my opinion on gun ownership in America. You have challenged my views and I have soul searched alot. I came to the conclusion I had deeply been influenced by my gov and media.

As a gun owner in England I have always disliked and regretted our lack of challenge on our restrictions.

But your country is still young and we have had more battles than you can shake a stick at. It just takes a lot more for us to get riled up.

We are more accepting in this period of our history.

That being said a lot of it is down to misinformation and propaganda and it's only with speaking and debating with are friends like you guys that we get perspective.

We are not going to agree on everything but we can influence eachother through good reasoning. If we become over agressive in our arguments it closes people down and that just ain't healthy.
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Old 02-10-2013, 10:00 PM   #188
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Yeah, were are not.

Our 2A and those defending it may very well be saving the few liberties that Brits cling to. Implications go beyond our shores.

Food for thought.
Your dead right, totally agree we need a good outcome at your end because you will be used as example by our gov against us.

That works both ways of course don't think for one minute that Obama has not sent his aids to the uk to examin our gun laws to bring back ideas to support his argument .

There has been talk at this end of a constitution in recent times, there has been an acknowledgment of the lack accountability of the gov. What with corruption and how they have treated the armed forces.

There is an awakening albeit very small. Maybe when Scotland gets it's independence in poss 2015 and gets it's own constitution it may spur on changes for England.
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Old 02-10-2013, 10:05 PM   #189
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Actually... I am "that" guy... Not something I'm proud of... but it is what it is.

My life has always been governed by honor... and doing the right thing regardless of who may be watching... or not watching.

The notion of accepting a ban on... or registration of... products I bought legally with money I earned honestly... after having served my Country honorably... Because a politician no longer trusts me with them?

I'm sorry, but what a politician trusts or does not trust is of no consequence to me or the manner in which I lead my life.

I will continue to do what I do, own what I own, and live my life the way I see fit... and god help the man who says otherwise...

Tack
Honesty is a good trait though; -D
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Old 02-10-2013, 10:09 PM   #190
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I would agree debates on this forum have made me look at the way i think about firearm laws and controls in the uk. Unfortunately i think it is already to late to get back what we have lost regards firearms in the uk.
Maybe you will have better luck in America. By getting politicians on board and other peaceful means. I don't think talk of revolution civil war etc is helpful. It will just make Americans that don't have a view one way or another come down on the side of gun control. The thought of guns in the hands of people with them sorts of views would concern a lot of Americans more than further gun controls like it or not.
i believe in peaceful resolution as long as it's working. IMO, i believe from what i have seen and heard so far to date, it's actually working, allbeit slowly but it is working. do i want to see armed conflict to secure and defend our freedoms and rights here in our own country? by all means no i don't! but if peaceful resolution and civil opposition fall by the wayside, then people have to make a decision as to whether they will comply or disobey. i hae made my decision and that's the choice i will make with no apologies for doing the right thing for the right reasons.
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