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Old 10-25-2013, 01:46 AM   #21
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While on probation or parole you are not a free man. There are conditions to your release that you must adhere to or go back to the crossbar hotel.

But after fully released you are a free man. And that should be enough to live with the rights of any other free man.
i can't agree with that. free or not, if you have a repeated history of rape, murder, vicious assaults.....you should be stripped of your 2nd amendment forever.

the reason? i don't agree with murders, pedophiles (or those who harm children) , or violent rapists EVER being paroled or set free....i could care less about violent criminals freedoms or rights....when people harm others is when it is appropriate to take rights away.

our justice system has a BAD history of releasing people who are still a real danger to others. UNTIL that STOPS, i am not ok with returning gun rights to criminals.
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Old 10-25-2013, 01:48 AM   #22
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The Amendments are "Thumb Nails". Hamilton, Madison and Jefferson wrote 85 essays under the name of "Publius". The Federalist papers set forth the points of the 2nd Amendment and its intent by the first Continental Congress. Before you rewrite this important authority read the the intent in the Federalist papers. This is the foundation of constitutional laws.

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Old 10-25-2013, 01:54 AM   #23
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If you have an apple device, you can download all of the historical documents from iBooks for free. Declaration of Independence, bill of rights, federalist papers, constitution, Give Me Liberty or Give Me Death, writings of Thomas Paine, Thomas Jefferson...

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Old 10-25-2013, 02:09 AM   #24
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i can't agree with that. free or not, if you have a repeated history of rape, murder, vicious assaults.....you should be stripped of your 2nd amendment forever.

the reason? i don't agree with murders, pedophiles (or those who harm children) , or violent rapists EVER being paroled or set free....i could care less about violent criminals freedoms or rights....when people harm others is when it is appropriate to take rights away.

our justice system has a BAD history of releasing people who are still a real danger to others. UNTIL that STOPS, i am not ok with returning gun rights to criminals.
You rather pay your debt or not. If not then don't release them to be free men. But at the end of the day a free man should have the rights of a free man.
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Old 10-25-2013, 02:18 AM   #25
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and i agree, its only part of the 2nd, but IMO, the most important part of the 2nd. only those who want to declare it obsolete or outdated want to debate it's meaning. it means what the founding fathers wrote.
well, there ARE exceptions and i am one....

i think the second is debatable because many terms are vague and can have many meanings, not because i think the second is obsolete....i think it is as relevant today as when it was written. and i don't agree that the second means there can be no limitations or restrictions. a line must be drawn SOMEWHERE.

WHERE that line is drawn is the heart of MANY debates, not just debates on the second.
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Old 10-25-2013, 02:20 AM   #26
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There is no compromise.

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Old 10-25-2013, 02:22 AM   #27
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You rather pay your debt or not. If not then don't release them to be free men. But at the end of the day a free man should have the rights of a free man.
in a good justice system, yes. in our justice system, i disagree. because many of the free men in our system do not deserve their freedom.
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Old 10-25-2013, 02:22 AM   #28
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"No free man shall be debarred the use of arms." Thomas Jefferson

If you can't be trusted to own a firearm, you are a threat to society. Why are these threats released upon on us?

I'm with Axxe on this one, "shall not be infringed" is pretty damn clear. The 2A(and the BoRs as a whole) were written so a layman could comprehend it. Why do the libs have such a hard time, mental deficiencies I guess?

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Old 10-25-2013, 02:27 AM   #29
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There is no compromise.
i don't consider no compromise a position of strength.

if our admired founding fathers adopted a "no compromise" stance....do you think our glorious constitution and bill of rights would even exist?

if you know you're history, you would know the founders were the ultimate compromises and what come from their compromise...was greatness.

compromise IS strength.
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Old 10-25-2013, 02:28 AM   #30
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well, there ARE exceptions and i am one....

i think the second is debatable because many terms are vague and can have many meanings, not because i think the second is obsolete....i think it is as relevant today as when it was written. and i don't agree that the second means there can be no limitations or restrictions. a line must be drawn SOMEWHERE.

WHERE that line is drawn is the heart of MANY debates, not just debates on the second.
The line is what an infantry man has. Infantry men don't have WMDs or ICBMs. Full auto, grenades, etc. are covered in the 2A IMO.

The 2A was designed to prevent tyranny, we should have the same tools as a "government soldier" to keep the government "honest". Currently we are not on a level playing field, which was the intent of our founding fathers.
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