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Old 11-01-2011, 02:11 AM   #21
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Yup; pretty much as I said in post #7.
Sorry. Didn't mean to duplicate what others had already said.
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Old 11-01-2011, 02:21 AM   #22
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The naivete of the news media is unbelievable. Eric Holder is the one that is giving the orders and they want him to step up and reign them in. I think most of the media people got their degrees at Berserkly.
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Old 11-01-2011, 02:36 AM   #23
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Didn't mean to duplicate what others had already said.
Some things bear repeating.
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Old 11-01-2011, 03:02 AM   #24
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The L.E. organizations have essentially become paramilitary. The "War on Terrorism" has changed the game. A nicety like a warrant has essentially been superseded by emergency powers.
Of course, to many people, the loss of those "niceties" also lost the "L.E." agencies their first step inside the door or chance to explain their business/demands. Not saying i am one of those people, but i certainly understand why they would feel that way and adjust their responses in such an extreme manner.

Call them crazies now, but later they may be known as "the resistance".

A sad pathetic situation our country has gotten into nowadays. The people who are supposed to be protecting us from the crazies trying to destroy our society sometimes seem like more of a threat to our way of life than the crazies were.
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Old 11-01-2011, 06:12 AM   #25
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I got the opportunity to speak with an fbi employed person who dealth with nics and things like that. He told me, very clearly, multiple times, that those background checks are not erased. They remain on file, he knew it was illegal, the people he worked with knew it was illegal. But that is simply how it is and there really isn't much they could do about it, if they wanted to.

Any 4473's that you fill out, are in the fbi database already, they have no need to go to the place you bought it from. Think about this, how would they know where to go to get records from the dealer who sold you the firearm if they didn't keep it (your 4473) on record?... exactly. They get the records from the dealers for show.

Call me paranoid, or make tin foil hats jokes all you want. I will assume the worst in all situations, and prepare accordingly. Murphy's law.
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Old 11-01-2011, 12:38 PM   #26
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Any 4473's that you fill out, are in the fbi database already, they have no need to go to the place you bought it from.
Bzzzt! No, I'm sorry, that's not correct, but thank you for playing our game. The FBI does have any 4473's at all. Only ATF receives those, and only when an FFL discontinues buisness.

As far as NICS goes, they don't receive any identifying information on the firearm, only the type (handgun, long gun, other). No manufacturer, no model, no serial number. Not much of a database, is it?

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Think about this, how would they know where to go to get records from the dealer who sold you the firearm if they didn't keep it (your 4473) on record?... exactly. They get the records from the dealers for show.
Traces start with the manufacturer, who will provide the ID of the FFL they sent to gun to, who in turn will ID the FFL they sent the gun to, until the FFL is reached who transferred it to a nonlicensee via a 4473. Simple, is it not?
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Old 11-01-2011, 04:10 PM   #27
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Bzzzt! No, I'm sorry, that's not correct, but thank you for playing our game. The FBI does have any 4473's at all. Only ATF receives those, and only when an FFL discontinues buisness.
Do you know who runs and operates NICS? It would seem you do not. The 4473 doesn't have identifying information, but the background check they (the dealer) sends in does. It has all of that juicy stuff.
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Old 11-01-2011, 04:14 PM   #28
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Yes, Cory, I do know who runs and operates NICS. Unlike you, I am an FFL and a registered user of NICS. Therefore, unlike you, I know exactly what gets submitted to the system. We do not submit any identifying information on the firearm to NICS, only the type of firearm (handgun, long gun, other).
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Old 11-01-2011, 04:14 PM   #29
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If anybody here thinks the feds adhere to the law, I have some great oceanside property in Arizona.
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Old 11-01-2011, 04:16 PM   #30
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Yes, Cory, I do know who runs and operates NICS. Unlike you, I am an FFL and a registered user of NICS. Therefore, unlike you, I know exactly what gets submitted to the system. We do not submit any identifying information on the firearm to NICS, only the type of firearm (handgun, long gun, other).


Not all that different from me really... But good try there buddy.
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