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Old 12-06-2012, 01:23 PM   #31
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Weighing the possibility of his coworker being shot, and knowing you might have been able to stop it and didn’t; I would think that would be a hard thing to live with. Character is all about what you do under extenuating circumstances, not normal ones.

Are you married? Do you have kids? Does your coworker have kids? It is fortunate a gun fight didn’t happen. That the $2k was saved is beside the point.

The problem for large organizations in events like this is they can’t make policy that takes in to account the varying levels of firearm experience and composure of both the staff and robber. The variables go off the chart. Hindsight is easy, but you don’t know how it’s going to turn out at the time. If you make exceptions, it’s not a policy.

If it was your company, would you give all your employees a free hand on how to handle an armed robbery? I guess it depends on the caliber of person you hire.

So, your choice: a) you follow policy; or b) you don’t. You do what you have to do.

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Old 12-06-2012, 05:46 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Vincine View Post
Weighing the possibility of his coworker being shot, and knowing you might have been able to stop it and didn’t; I would think that would be a hard thing to live with. Character is all about what you do under extenuating circumstances, not normal ones.

Are you married? Do you have kids? Does your coworker have kids? It is fortunate a gun fight didn’t happen. That the $2k was saved is beside the point.

The problem for large organizations in events like this is they can’t make policy that takes in to account the varying levels of firearm experience and composure of both the staff and robber. The variables go off the chart. Hindsight is easy, but you don’t know how it’s going to turn out at the time. If you make exceptions, it’s not a policy.

If it was your company, would you give all your employees a free hand on how to handle an armed robbery? I guess it depends on the caliber of person you hire.

So, your choice: a) you follow policy; or b) you don’t. You do what you have to do.
You are partially correct. You cannot possibly have policies for every situation, but policy can very quickly hinder the individuals ability to perform their duty as they see fit within their abilities, be that changing a light bulb (policy states that a qualified union electrician must perform that duty) or retrieving your firearm from your car to protect the life of a co-worker. This is a case of that happening.

I am a small business owner. We are basically an all-cash business. Our stated recommendation is that if a robbery attempt is made, give the robber the money and do everything you can to prevent injury to yourself. Hell, I have told employees to carry the cash out to the car and say "Have a nice day!" to the robbers if that will keep them safe. Employee safety is far more important than any amount of money. We also have a stated no firearms recommendation. But we do not enforce it and many employees carry on the job. I'm not going to tell them they cant as a matter of policy. I will (and do) tell them that they must keep anything they might be carrying totally concealed, even from me, while working. Some employees will follow my recommendations and some will take action on their own (and are fully capable of doing so) This is called character and leadership, and a big reason why I hire those people. So far we have not had a situation arise where this has become a problem.

The problem is that big corporations make blanket "zero tolerance" policies for things that there needs to be some latitude on. The TSA is an excellent example of this sort of stupidity, Trip mentioned a situation where he was in the military and carrying loaded firearms on duty on commercial passenger airlines yet they still insisted on confiscating his pocket knife. Another member here (I forget who) witnessed the same sort of stupidity under identical circumstances but it was nail clippers.

Personally I have very little tolerance (worth pointing out that I DID NOT say "zero tolerance") for that kind of stupidity. This is the only reason I no longer fly and will not fly again unless I really have to (extenuating circumstances.).
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Old 12-06-2012, 11:13 PM   #33
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I like what you said here.

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Originally Posted by Vikingdad View Post
You are partially correct. You cannot possibly have policies for every situation, but policy can very quickly hinder the individuals ability to perform their duty as they see fit within their abilities, be that changing a light bulb (policy states that a qualified union electrician must perform that duty) or retrieving your firearm from your car to protect the life of a co-worker. This is a case of that happening.

I am a small business owner. We are basically an all-cash business. Our stated recommendation is that if a robbery attempt is made, give the robber the money and do everything you can to prevent injury to yourself. Hell, I have told employees to carry the cash out to the car and say "Have a nice day!" to the robbers if that will keep them safe. Employee safety is far more important than any amount of money. We also have a stated no firearms recommendation. But we do not enforce it and many employees carry on the job. I'm not going to tell them they cant as a matter of policy. I will (and do) tell them that they must keep anything they might be carrying totally concealed, even from me, while working. Some employees will follow my recommendations and some will take action on their own (and are fully capable of doing so) This is called character and leadership, and a big reason why I hire those people. So far we have not had a situation arise where this has become a problem.

The problem is that big corporations make blanket "zero tolerance" policies for things that there needs to be some latitude on. The TSA is an excellent example of this sort of stupidity, Trip mentioned a situation where he was in the military and carrying loaded firearms on duty on commercial passenger airlines yet they still insisted on confiscating his pocket knife. Another member here (I forget who) witnessed the same sort of stupidity under identical circumstances but it was nail clippers.

Personally I have very little tolerance (worth pointing out that I DID NOT say "zero tolerance") for that kind of stupidity. This is the only reason I no longer fly and will not fly again unless I really have to (extenuating circumstances.).
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Old 12-06-2012, 11:26 PM   #34
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I agree this is unacceptable. Unfortunately this is the case for most corporate owned retailers. I used to work in an AT&T wireless store and we had to sign a form upon employment stating that any attempt to stop a theft,robbery, etc. would result in immediate dismissal.

It happened to a friend that worked at Sears. A man was beating his wife IN THE STORE and the employee went to the woman's aid. Shoved the man who fell and probably bruised a knee or some sh!t. He sued and got a settlement from Sears. That's the American legal system for you. It's not for me to say it doesn't work but often times it is abused in this manner.

As a side note, I despise AT&T. All of it.

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Old 12-07-2012, 08:15 AM   #35
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Smart & Final has the same policy. Any employee who tries to stop a robbery will be terminated.

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Old 12-07-2012, 09:54 AM   #36
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Default I'm just wondering:

I'm just wondering:

What if an employee follows policy and lets a robber take the money, then follows the robber out of the store, and steals it from the robber. Can they keep it?

If the Corp policy is to relinquish the money, how is it still property that was stolen from the store?

Would the employee have to 'punch out' first, so it's on his own time? What if it's done on their break?

What if the employee says, "I quit" so he is no longer an employee of the company and thus not subject to it's rules, then proceeds to recover the money, or prevent the robbery in the first place. Would the employee get to keep it? If not, perhaps be get a reward or be rehired?

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Old 12-07-2012, 02:46 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincine View Post
I'm just wondering:

What if an employee follows policy and lets a robber take the money, then follows the robber out of the store, and steals it from the robber. Can they keep it?

If the Corp policy is to relinquish the money, how is it still property that was stolen from the store?

Would the employee have to 'punch out' first, so it's on his own time? What if it's done on their break?

What if the employee says, "I quit" so he is no longer an employee of the company and thus not subject to it's rules, then proceeds to recover the money, or prevent the robbery in the first place. Would the employee get to keep it? If not, perhaps be get a reward or be rehired?
We have 15 people who work in our store and we ALL got $73 total (not individually) to spend on a Christmas party. You think they would offer a reward.....lol
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Old 12-07-2012, 04:01 PM   #38
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We have 15 people who work in our store and we ALL got $73 total (not individually) to spend on a Christmas party. You think they would offer a reward.....lol
You know what I would do with $73? I would wait until after closing one evening, go to the liquor store and buy $73 worth of cheap beer and then go back to the store and have an employee Christmas party! (cab rides home required for all who drink alcohol, but the employee must pay out of pocket.)

This leads into a completely different conversation about Christmas parties in general- one I don't care to get into right now.
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Old 12-07-2012, 04:10 PM   #39
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You know what I would do with $73? I would wait until after closing one evening, go to the liquor store and buy $73 worth of cheap beer and then go back to the store and have an employee Christmas party! (cab rides home required for all who drink alcohol, but the employee must pay out of pocket.)

This leads into a completely different conversation about Christmas parties in general- one I don't care to get into right now.
They are going a pizza buffet, but I have excluded myself. My other company gives a individual $250 Christmas bonus and $180 meal (well up to that amount for a couple). AutoZone makes more than my primary company
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Old 12-07-2012, 04:12 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverado113

We have 15 people who work in our store and we ALL got $73 total (not individually) to spend on a Christmas party. You think they would offer a reward.....lol
Keep up with that checkout challenge, and you might get an even $80 ;-)
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