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Old 04-03-2014, 11:13 AM   #61
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Well spoken and well summed Up Axxe..


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Old 04-03-2014, 08:35 PM   #62
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The United states doesn't have to defend it's murder rate to any country. The US has a very low murder rate when compared to the rest of the world. It's foolish for gun owners to allow the anti's to compare murder rates with a handful of countries that have a lower murder rate than the USA.
That's a fair point, but I see pro gun posts on this forum comparing countries firearms laws all the time to try and support their view. You can't have it both ways its ok to post comparisons to support one view but not another. Example below of what I am talking about. it conveniently left out countries that have strict firearms laws and a lower murder rate than America. And is incorrect in lots of other ways. Most automatically just agreed with the post because it backed their view without looking at it and questioning if it was correct. There were a few exceptions that did question its accuracy.

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Default The Right of Citizens to Keep and Bare Arms!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Does It Work!
Check out these statistics. Im sure the Libertards who are attacking our Second Amendment does not want people to see this! Pass it on!
I did not check each and every one of the statistics posted in this document but did a spot check on several and the statistics shown are correct! So does the Right of the Citizens of the USA to carry payoff! You answer that one after viewing the below statistics. IT IS VERY OBVIOUS! Check this out! We need to be sure this information is passed on to everyone we know and for them to pass it on. It is the only way we can contradict and tell the truth other than the out and out lies coming from the left! So PASS IT ON!

03

It is hard to believe the general public can’t grasp this….
Please go all the way down the list for the "bottom line". . .
This is FASCINATING !!
WORLD MURDER STATISTICS
From the World Health Organization

The latest Murder Statistics for the world:
Murders per 100,000 citizens per year.

Honduras 91.6 (WOW!!)
El Salvador 69.2
Cote d'lvoire 56.9
Jamaica 52.2
Venezuela 45.1
Belize 41.4
US Virgin Islands 39.2
Guatemala 38.5
Saint Kitts and Nevis 38.2
Zambia 38.0
Uganda 36.3
Malawi 36.0
Lesotho 35.2
Trinidad and Tobago 35.2
Colombia 33.4
South Africa 31.8
Congo 30.8
Central African Republic 29.3
Bahamas 27.4
Puerto Rico 26.2
Saint Lucia 25.2
Dominican Republic 25.0
Tanzania 24.5
Sudan 24.2
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines 22.9
Ethiopia 22.5
Guinea 22.5
Dominica 22.1
Burundi 21.7
Democratic Republic of the Congo 21.7
Panama 21.6
Brazil 21.0
Equatorial Guinea 20.7
Guinea-Bissau 20.2
Kenya 20.1
Kyrgyzstan 20.1
Cameroon 19.7
Montserrat 19.7
Greenland 19.2
Angola 19.0
Guyana 18.6
Burkina Faso 18.0
Eritrea 17.8
Namibia 17.2
Rwanda 17.1
Mexico 16.9
Chad 15.8
Ghana 15.7
Ecuador 15.2
North Korea 15.2
Benin 15.1
Sierra Leone 14.9
Mauritania 14.7
Botswana 14.5
Zimbabwe 14.3
Gabon 13.8
Nicaragua 13.6
French Guiana 13.3
Papua New Guinea 13.0
Swaziland 12.9
Bermuda 12.3
Comoros 12.2
Nigeria 12.2
Cape Verde 11.6
Grenada 11.5
Paraguay 11.5
Barbados 11.3
Togo 10.9
Gambia 10.8
Peru 10.8
Myanmar 10.2
Russia 10.2
Liberia 10.1
Costa Rica 10.0
Nauru 9.8
Bolivia 8.9
Mozambique 8.8
Kazakhstan 8.8
Senegal 8.7
Turks and Caicos Islands 8.7
Mongolia 8.7
British Virgin Islands 8.6
Cayman Islands 8.4
Seychelles 8.3
Madagascar 8.1
Indonesia 8.1
Mali 8.0
Pakistan 7.8
Moldova 7.5
Kiribati 7.3
Guadeloupe 7.0
Haiti 6.9
Timor-Leste 6.9
Anguilla 6.8
Antigua and Barbuda 6.8
Lithuania 6.6
Uruguay 5.9
Philippines 5.4
Ukraine 5.2
Estonia 5.2
Cuba 5.0
Belarus 4.9
Thailand 4.8
Suriname 4.6
Laos 4.6
Georgia 4.3
Martinique 4.2
And ..............................................

The United States 4.2 !!!!!!!!!!!!

ALL (109) of the countries above America have 100% gun bans and or strict laws restricting and or against citizens carrying.

It might be of interest to note that SWITZERLAND is not shown on this list because it has
NO MURDER OCCURRENCE!
However, SWITZERLAND'S law requires that EVERYONE:
1. Own a gun.
2. Maintain Marksman qualifications .... regularly .
Did you learn anything from this??

I think the message is - loud and clear - that gun bans and restrictions
DO NOT work!
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Old 04-04-2014, 02:13 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by manta View Post
That's a fair point, but I see pro gun posts on this forum comparing countries firearms laws all the time to try and support their view. You can't have it both ways its ok to post comparisons to support one view but not another. Example below of what I am talking about. it conveniently left out countries that have strict firearms laws and a lower murder rate than America. And is incorrect in lots of other ways. Most automatically just agreed with the post because it backed their view without looking at it and questioning if it was correct. There were a few exceptions that did question its accuracy.
Agreed.

So, if there's something logical that we could do about firearms related deaths in America (like a national campaign to promote prudent firearms handling and storage, providing resources for laws regarding firearms since there are so many laws pertaining to firearms ownership and use, and ethics regarding use of force to defend yourself; morality can't be instilled through legislation but it can be through indoctrination) then I think that would be a good thing and something that would be a better use of our politicians time than trying to find ways to take firearms from citizens who lawfully own and use firearms.

Either most Americans are criminals and should be disarmed to inhibit criminal activities or most Americans follow the law and the solution to the "problem" should revolve around ensuring that firearms are not used by criminals.

There are three things that will inhibit criminal use of firearms:

1. Prosecute and incarcerate criminals for using firearms in crimes (and not simply whatever criminal activity they were involved in while illegally using a firearm).

It's hard to commit the nth crime with a firearm if you're in prison for an extra five or ten years for using a firearm in the commission of a crime.

2. Ensure that the general population is trained and armed.

This is perhaps the only real deterrent to criminals using force to get what they want.

3. Police should treat the citizenry as an asset to the execution of their duties instead of an unknown or unquantifiable threat to contend with. This really comes down to the personal integrity, courage, and lawful behavior of individual officers.

Police officers should be model servants, not a paramilitary force with attitude. For whatever reason, the military training seems to do a better job of indoctrination in this regard than the police training does.

If you want to fight, join the military. Otherwise, come to terms with the meaning of the words "peace officer" and act accordingly.
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Old 04-04-2014, 02:22 AM   #64
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i am coming to the belief that we can't even bring ourselves to common ground as gun owners in defending our gun rights. we can't even come to understand and unite on even one small issue, gun control. people keep harping on crime rates, murder rates and what lies the liberal are spreading. the issue is gun control, not crime, or criminal control. keep bickering amongst yourselves and it will happen, the liberals will win and then all gun owners can feel what it's like to either be a criminal or become a sheep.

preaching anymore about it seems to be doing no good as i see the same old argument being pondered over and the real issue, gun control doesn't even enter the debate.

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Old 04-04-2014, 03:31 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by Axxe55 View Post
i am coming to the belief that we can't even bring ourselves to common ground as gun owners in defending our gun rights. we can't even come to understand and unite on even one small issue, gun control. people keep harping on crime rates, murder rates and what lies the liberal are spreading. the issue is gun control, not crime, or criminal control. keep bickering amongst yourselves and it will happen, the liberals will win and then all gun owners can feel what it's like to either be a criminal or become a sheep.

preaching anymore about it seems to be doing no good as i see the same old argument being pondered over and the real issue, gun control doesn't even enter the debate.
Sorry Brother, the real issue is that the public having guns for defense WORRIES the ELITE, Politicians and others who worry that the citizens will rise up and KILL all them,the Traitors, right now that IS the Congress, the Senate, the Supreme court,(Lawless Nine) and the Executive branch. ALL are guilty of TREASON, should be tried and Hanged in short order. The Gov. can NOT take away a god given right.

Progressive Liberal DemocRATS are my Enemy and yours.

Hope you all are paying close attention to the rally in Conn. this saturday.
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Old 04-04-2014, 03:38 AM   #66
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i have said all i plan on saying on this subject. it appears to be falling on deaf ears and no one seems to care about the true reasons for gun control.

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Old 04-05-2014, 12:23 AM   #67
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Sorry Brother, the real issue is that the public having guns for defense WORRIES the ELITE, Politicians and others who worry that the citizens will rise up and KILL all them,the Traitors, right now that IS the Congress, the Senate, the Supreme court,(Lawless Nine) and the Executive branch. ALL are guilty of TREASON, should be tried and Hanged in short order. The Gov. can NOT take away a god given right
I am not sure how to reply to that. So you are saying that the whole us government and courts are traitors and should be hanged. As well I assume the people that voted for them, and the country run by people like you. With the attitude if people don't have the same view as you they should be hanged, As for a god given right I thought it was a written constitution by men not god.
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Old 04-05-2014, 12:54 AM   #68
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I am not sure how to reply to that. So you are saying that the whole us government and courts are traitors and should be hanged. As well I assume the people that voted for them, and the country run by people like you. With the attitude if people don't have the same view as you they should be hanged, As for a god given right I thought it was a written constitution by men not god.
The "men" that wrote the constitution did not grant our rights, they are saying that these are God given or natural rights, if you prefer, and that the government can't take them away. Elected officials and the military swear an oath to protect the CONSTITUTION, not the government. Any one who supports the destruction of this document are traitors. They are enemies of all of us who swore this oath. This isn't complicated.
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Old 04-05-2014, 03:18 AM   #69
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The "men" that wrote the constitution did not grant our rights, they are saying that these are God given or natural rights, if you prefer, and that the government can't take them away. Elected officials and the military swear an oath to protect the CONSTITUTION, not the government. Any one who supports the destruction of this document are traitors. They are enemies of all of us who swore this oath. This isn't complicated.
Exactly. The constitution didn't give us our rights, God did.
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Old 04-05-2014, 03:20 AM   #70
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Exactly. The constitution didn't give us our rights, God did.
rather obvious you simply skipped over the 1st amendment. freedom of religion or lack of. so if a person doesn't believe or worship God, who did they get their rights from?
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