Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com

Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/)
-   Legal and Activism (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f97/)
-   -   Debate Thread: Countering Gun Control (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f97/debate-thread-countering-gun-control-105643/)

Vikingdad 03-30-2014 06:25 PM

Debate Thread: Countering Gun Control
 
Seems there is a need here for this. If you are getting all butt-hurt over something in the Countering Gun Control thread then bring it here. At the moment there is some contention regarding comparative data between countries. Here is what I have to contribute on that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ooa98FHuaU0

Ez2b 03-30-2014 06:57 PM

Ah a good place for Pierce Morgan to keep picking our brain lol

Alias +++++

John_Deer 03-30-2014 07:02 PM

One thing Manta is correct about is anti gun people do not want to argue statistics. I told a liberal about the FBI crime database. I even loaded the FBI crime database so he could see for himself. He refused to look at my laptop. One would have thought I was trying to burn his eyes out with a laser beam.

manta 03-30-2014 07:16 PM

Probably a good idea. :) I have no issue with people posting pro gun posters and articles supporting their position. But I do have a problem when I see some of it is misleading and just wrong and people doint like it being challenged. I see similar on anti gun sites misleading and wrong information, something that is challenged on this forum all the time. You would get the impression that its OK to challenge anti gun information that's incorrect but not pro gun information that is incorrect. I like to think for myself and not blindly unquestionably follow one view even if it supports my view if the information is wrong. Posting pro gun information that is questionable and insulting to others,( Example if you doint like my view get out of the country. ) Is no better than the anti gun lobby doing the same.

Axxe55 03-30-2014 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manta (Post 1544411)
Probably a good idea. :) I have no issue with people posting pro gun posters and articles supporting their position. But I do have a problem when I see some of it is misleading and just wrong and people doint like it being challenged. I see similar on anti gun sites misleading and wrong information, something that is challenged on this forum all the time. You would get the impression that its OK to challenge anti gun information that's incorrect but not pro gun information that is incorrect. I like to think for myself and not blindly unquestionably follow one view even if it supports my view if the information is wrong. Posting pro gun information that is questionable and insulting to others,( Example if you doint like my view get out of the country. ) Is no better than the anti gun lobby doing the same.

even if someone is pro-gun and they are giving false or misleading information, andi know it's false, i will be one of the first ones to show them them the error of their ways. simply because it does the cause for our gun rights no good. the best defence we have against the liberal gun haters, and those wanting to bring about more gun control are using the facts and nothing but the facts.

and simply put, those who want gun control can get out as far i'm concerned. they are more than welcome to move to a country that has strict gun control or bans guns altogether. America was founded on the citizens being able to defend themselves for tyranny and oppression from the government.

i'm not going to force my opinion on others, but will simply state my feelings about such things. after all, i do believe in the 1st amendment as well.

Vikingdad 03-30-2014 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manta (Post 1544411)
Probably a good idea. :) I have no issue with people posting pro gun posters and articles supporting their position. But I do have a problem when I see some of it is misleading and just wrong and people doint like it being challenged. I see similar on anti gun sites misleading and wrong information, something that is challenged on this forum all the time. You would get the impression that its OK to challenge anti gun information that's incorrect but not pro gun information that is incorrect. I like to think for myself and not blindly unquestionably follow one view even if it supports my view if the information is wrong. Posting pro gun information that is questionable and insulting to others,( Example if you doint like my view get out of the country. ) Is no better than the anti gun lobby doing the same.

If there is false or misleading information posted on the other thread then point it out as such and if its bad enough I would also report the post.

What you and others were doing there was debating your own opinions and thoughts on the info posted more than pointing out errors. That was not keeping in the stated spirit of the thread.

As to your other post
Quote:

Originally Posted by manta (Post 1544315)
So you are happy for pro firearms articles and essays to be posted. And then ( command ) that no one is allowed to point out any material that is wrong in the articles. I thought this was an American forum not Russian or Chinese. Posting a thread and then telling people how they are allowed to respond to it , is not the way internet forums or free speech work.

You did not correctly understand the instructions on the thread. There is absolutely nothing preventing you from pointing out incorrect material. As a matter of fact I would say that it is encouraged. It does our advocacy no good to be throwing around incorrect or false information. Point it out when you see it. Posting a thread and making it clear as to what the purpose of that specific thread is supposed to do in the creator's mind is perfectly fine. You can do exactly the same thing. For example, I created this thread here for the purpose of debating things posted there! Viola! A few painless keystrokes and BOOM! Done!.:eek:

No need to get all pissy and compare America to Russia or China. That is just uncalled for (or is it? Lets debate!):cool:

Quote:

You don't post on a forum and then tell people how they are allowed respond. Threads can evolve and change direction, its for the mods to decide if post are going off topic not the people posting.
Seeing as its the Mods who did decide you were off topic I would say that you were out of line! :p

manta 03-30-2014 08:20 PM

Quote:

and simply put, those who want gun control can get out as far i'm concerned. they are more than welcome to move to a country that has strict gun control or bans guns altogether. America was founded on the citizens being able to defend themselves for tyranny and oppression from the government
I understand what you are saying. People are quick to point to the American constitution regards the right to bear arms, I am sure there is something in the constitution about the right to free speech and to think and believe what you want, I am sure it doesn't end with unless its anti gun in that case you can get out of the country. I think that people have just as much right to have a anti gun view as I have to have a pro gun view. And I think I can convince some to my point of view by talking to them and question their view. Not by putting up the same rubbish that you would see on anti gun sites only a pro gun version of the same.

Warrior1256 03-30-2014 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John_Deer (Post 1544405)
One thing Manta is correct about is anti gun people do not want to argue statistics. I told a liberal about the FBI crime database. I even loaded the FBI crime database so he could see for himself. He refused to look at my laptop. One would have thought I was trying to burn his eyes out with a laser beam.

The antis are not interested in fact, they simply want to disarm law abiding citizens.

rjd3282 03-30-2014 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manta (Post 1544436)
I understand what you are saying. People are quick to point to the American constitution regards the right to bear arms, I am sure there is something in the constitution about the right to free speech and to think and believe what you want, I am sure it doesn't end with unless its anti gun in that case you can get out of the country. I think that people have just as much right to have a anti gun view as I have to have a pro gun view. And I think I can convince some to my point of view by talking to them and question their view. Not by putting up the same rubbish that you would see on anti gun sites only a pro gun version of the same.

Nothing wrong with them having a different point of view, it is a problem when they try to force that point of view on others. The constitution clearly states that the people have a natural right to keep and bear arms and that right shall not be infringed. Everyone in political office and military service took an oath to defend the constitution against all enemies. Any body trying to take away my constitutional rights is an enemy. Nothing complicated about this. We don't need to convince these idiots of anything, it's already written for them to see and myself and many many others have taken an oath to defend the constitution from them.

Axxe55 03-31-2014 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manta (Post 1544436)
I understand what you are saying. People are quick to point to the American constitution regards the right to bear arms, I am sure there is something in the constitution about the right to free speech and to think and believe what you want, I am sure it doesn't end with unless its anti gun in that case you can get out of the country. I think that people have just as much right to have a anti gun view as I have to have a pro gun view. And I think I can convince some to my point of view by talking to them and question their view. Not by putting up the same rubbish that you would see on anti gun sites only a pro gun version of the same.

yes i believe in the 1st amendment, and a person is allowed to speak their thoughts and opinions, and i too if i disagree, with those thoughts and opinions, then i am allowed to speak against them in opposition.

if you will notice the 2nd amendment follows the 1st and for very good reason. the founding fathers knew that to uphold the rights of the 1st, that there had to be a 2nd. and the citizens needed to be armed to be able to defend the rights of the first, and all the other amendments that followed. to restrict the power of the government.

and yes, the anti gun people are allowed to have an opinion, but my opposing thought is they need to move elsewhere where they don't have guns or have stricter gun control laws. just because i have that opinion does not mean i would physically force them to move or attempt to make them move. it's strictly an opinion based on the the viewpoint they have in regards to guns and our Constitution.

very simply put, This Is America. Love It, Or Leave It.


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:20 AM.

Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.