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Old 01-02-2013, 03:28 PM   #591
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Some do both.
Everytime I've taken anything to PM, it suddenly was no longer "worth it". And I've done it many times. It suddenly isn't nearly as satisfying to vehemently share your opinion when you don't have anyone watching any longer.
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Old 01-02-2013, 03:44 PM   #592
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Sure, sure. Because you know me so well. People like me are the reason they're afraid of lawsuits, which is why people like me get promotions and the raises to go with them. From officer to supervisor, and 10 bucks to 16 bucks an hour, in less than a year.

Your right, I must've been a real detriment to their image.
I guess some would say that's a pretty good jump in salary...

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Old 01-02-2013, 05:09 PM   #593
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I guess some would say that's a pretty good jump in salary...

eldar
If that's your ultimate statement, that the pay sucks....
I concede. You win. The pay does suck.

And THAT is where all your jibber jabber about the police unions pushing them around has had the most effect.

But to be fair, cops don't get paid a hell of a lot more, depending on their region/city/locale.
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Old 01-02-2013, 05:32 PM   #594
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Many police start at about $25,000. After five years they are making $35,000 plus.

A deputy sheriff friend of mine retired making $76,000 after 25 years on the force. And he was just a deputy.

Corporals and sergeants bring home even more. Officers top them.

You are correct. By making Security companies less effective, they are paid a lot less.

Even though, in many instances they face many of the same dangers.

Without the higher pay. Without the shield of the city/county/state protecting them from lawsuits. Without the pensions. Or health care.

Because of the legislation passed on behalf of police unions.

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Old 01-02-2013, 05:37 PM   #595
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Ugh. I've been on both sides of that argument. As have almost everyone I know. The disparity is not quite as great as you make it out to be. It's there, but not quite as bad as your make it out.

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Old 01-02-2013, 06:11 PM   #596
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The average unarmed Security Officer makes minimum wage to ten bucks an hour.

And only gets a pay raise when the minumum rate is increased OR they take a position at a post that pays a higher rate OR they become armed Security Officers OR they take a job doing something else.

The best Security companies establish 'esprit de corp' within its roles. The worst treat their SO's as just a body...

Securitas AB (Sweden) is the largest Security company in the world and provides nearly 50% of the Security Officers in the United States. It is interesting to note that during the late 1990's/early 2000's Securitas was owned by the People's Republic of China.

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Old 01-02-2013, 06:47 PM   #597
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I decided to wait several days to post on the Sandy Hook tragedy. First I have been praying for the families of the children and school staff, that they find peace and comfort. Then for the family of the shooter, he is the criminal here and as far as I can see they have a huge burden to bear also in the shock and shame of what happened.

I strongly feel that we should look at Israel and how they protect their schools. Allow armed school staff after they have completed a competency course. Post armed guards consisting of LEO's or Military members at every school. Then we should look at the public places like the movie theaters and shopping malls. No this will not stop the TERRORIST attacks on the American public but IT WILL greatly lower the death toll.

All in all I feel this was a terrorist attack, it was intended to cause terror and casualties at all cost. It was a success I am afraid to say, a success in the worst kind of way I can imagine. Killing children like this is just about as horrible as anything that I can think of. But regardless of the tools used to do this with a defenseless target the outcome would have been very much the same, the ONLY way to change these outcomes is change them from being defenseless to well DEFENDED.

Mr. Obama and members of Congress I hope you are getting bombarded with letters, emails and phone calls to this effect.

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Old 01-02-2013, 07:28 PM   #598
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I agree...in the short term, because it's the best we can hope for, however, being a father of 4 I would much rather see an end to Gun Free Zones where teachers and administrators could be armed in a concealed manner.

I believe ^^THIS^^ is a much more effective solution because:

1. It does not provide an EASY first target. "Remeber, Sandy Hook is not the norm, most of the school shootings are carried out by students who would know armed securities routines."

2. Durring an event, frightened students and staff would see direction Comming from armed "and trusted" teachers and admin...not some guy in a uniform who may or may not be familiar with the buildings layout and the locations of students at any given time.

In short...arming the staff, who choose the responsibility, is far more effective than hired guns, and, I think we already have enough of a police state. Personally, I'd rather not have my kids intoctrinated into following the orders of a Government Cop.

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I decided to wait several days to post on the Sandy Hook tragedy. First I have been praying for the families of the children and school staff, that they find peace and comfort. Then for the family of the shooter, he is the criminal here and as far as I can see they have a huge burden to bear also in the shock and shame of what happened.

I strongly feel that we should look at Israel and how they protect their schools. Allow armed school staff after they have completed a competency course. Post armed guards consisting of LEO's or Military members at every school. Then we should look at the public places like the movie theaters and shopping malls. No this will not stop the TERRORIST attacks on the American public but IT WILL greatly lower the death toll.

All in all I feel this was a terrorist attack, it was intended to cause terror and casualties at all cost. It was a success I am afraid to say, a success in the worst kind of way I can imagine. Killing children like this is just about as horrible as anything that I can think of. But regardless of the tools used to do this with a defenseless target the outcome would have been very much the same, the ONLY way to change these outcomes is change them from being defenseless to well DEFENDED.

Mr. Obama and members of Congress I hope you are getting bombarded with letters, emails and phone calls to this effect.
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Old 01-02-2013, 07:36 PM   #599
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Everytime I've taken anything to PM, it suddenly was no longer "worth it". And I've done it many times. It suddenly isn't nearly as satisfying to vehemently share your opinion when you don't have anyone watching any longer.
It may not be that. I know, I belong to the forum for multiple opinions. If you take it to PM you rule out any posiibillity of someone else chimeing in with a good 'point' or idea. That's what a 'forum' is all about IMO.
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Old 01-02-2013, 11:31 PM   #600
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First of all, I have no kids left in school, so I don't have a dog in the hunt. I may have grand kids coming, so I do have at least a periphery interest in this. I did some math yesterday. I saw somewhere that there are 131,000 schools in the US. So I looked at arming one security guard for each school, which I do not believe is enough, at $10 per hour, which may be absurdly low, but I don't know. This is what I came up with.

131,000 schools, with one person at $10/hour, roughly 32.5 hours per week (that's right people, your kids go to school roughly 5.5 hours per day, and 30 min each before school and after the dismissal bell). Multiplying this by approx 39 weeks in a school calandar, you come up with a cost of $1,660,425,000 for all of the schools. Assuming my info on numbers, and my guess at hourly pay, hours in a week, and weeks in a year are correct. I also think one is not enough. Two or three per school are better.

I cannot see the states paying it. these kids are not the states kids, and to some of these politicos may be more valuable politically as martyrs.

This is why we who are retired, or close to retiring need to find a way collectively to offer our services one or two days a week. We can probably find a way to have two or three of us at a school, which is a much better number then one. Training could be planned and administered by the NRA or some other organization.

In an ideal world, we would be given at least a tax write off for ammo for practice.

I know I am close to retirement, and would gladly give up some time for this.

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