Firearm & Gun Forum -

Firearm & Gun Forum - (
-   Legal and Activism (
-   -   Castle doctrine (

gwk4667 01-05-2012 10:50 AM

Castle doctrine
Do you live in one of the 11 states where this young mother would have been arested?

If so call your state officials and join the 39 ( Oklahoma was one thank fully ) where she did everything right! She was on the phone for 21 minutes with 911 before she pulled the trigger!

Oklahoma Teen Mom Shoots Intruder Dead | Calls 911 First for Permission | Sarah McKinley | Oklahoma City | Video |

texaswoodworker 01-05-2012 11:15 AM

Nope, I live in the Great State of Texas where it is legal to shoot intruders. I believe it is also legal to shoot someone just for trespassing on your land, but that is not something I would shoot someone over unless they were endangering someone. Glad to hear that her and her baby is safe. I call that a happy ending.

winds-of-change 01-05-2012 11:19 AM

I don't beleive this young Mother would have been arrested in most states. The intruder was coming at her with a knife. She was being approached with 'deadly force' and I believe she had every right to shoot. Isn't the "Castle Doctrine" giving one the right to shoot any intruder or trespasser? Deadly force puts this on a whole new level.

And I agree with Texas. I would not shoot a trespasser simply for trespassing........unless someone was in danger.

alsaqr 01-05-2012 12:30 PM

The OK law came into effect in 1987. A Tulsa dentist killed a home invader. An ambulance chasing Tulsa lawyer went to the family of the late perp and talked them into suing the dentist. This really po'd a member of the OK legislature named Ford: Ford put together the castle doctrine bill and it was passed by the OK legislature. Our governor signed the bill into law.

Since the OK "make my day law" went into effect there have been numerous righteous home invasion shootings in OK: No one has ever collected a dime in a civil lawsuit related to a righteous shooting. Judges throw most of these civil suits out of court.

Paladin201 01-05-2012 12:31 PM

I can only speak to the laws here in Missouri, which underwent a huge change in 2007, during the short time we were graced with a republican governor. Before the passage of the Castle Doctrine here, our law was really restrictive on the use of deadly force. First, the law required that you retreat. You could not defend yourself unless you had no other option. You were required to run away first, and escape if at all possible. If an intruder kicked in your front door, and the back door was accessible, you had to retreat. Never mind if you were in your night clothes and its 20 below outside. If there was a way out, the law required you to take it. Secondly, the law stated that you had to prove that the intruder actually intended to kill you or cause great bodily harm. If you shot a bad guy and he survived to tell the police "I wasn't going to hurt them, I was just going to rob them", you'd find yourself behind bars. So, with the old law, the woman from OK could certainly have been prosecuted. Whether she actually would have would be up to prosecuting attorney in the particular jurisdiction. However, St. Louis County, where I live is very hostile to gun owners, so I'm guessing if it happened here, she would have been in trouble under the old law.

Now, with the Castle Doctrine, you are not required to retreat. You can stand your ground and defend yourself and your family. And the simple presence of an intruder in your home presumes intent to do harm, allowing you to shoot an intruder without warning. Now, you do have to temper that with some common sense. My CCW instructor was a retired lawyer, and he said if you heard a noise and went up the hall to find some guy in the process of carrying your TV out the front door, if you shoot him in the back, you may face some legal problems, Castle Doctrine or not. So if the OK events happened here now, no problem. The lady would be well within her rights.

Oh, and our castle doctrine specifically states that you cannot be sued in civil court due to any injury or damage resulting from a justifiable shooting.

texaswoodworker 01-05-2012 12:47 PM


Originally Posted by Paladin201 (Post 668180)
My CCW instructor was a retired lawyer, and he said if you heard a noise and went up the hall to find some guy in the process of carrying your TV out the front door, if you shoot him in the back, you may face some legal problems, Castle Doctrine or not.

I believe that is true here too. You can shoot anybody (and I do mean anybody. Some nutjob around houston shot (I think she survived) a very young trick or treater for trespassing on his property. He was legally justified, though he is now concidered a major jackass.:mad:) as long as you do not shoot them in the back.

fisher79 01-05-2012 01:22 PM

I'm in texas to and if you break in my house with my children there you ain't gonna make it back out! Prison or not.

fisher79 01-05-2012 01:25 PM

Woodworker you are correct that guy is a jackass a little trick-or-treater that's horrible. Must have been scared of zombies:moron:

JonM 01-05-2012 01:35 PM

A common misconception about castle laws is that you can shoot anyone just because they are in your home. What castle law is, is a presumption of innocence if a home owner uses lethal force for self defense against an unlawful intruder.

Thats a big difference.

The shooting still has to rise to the level of self defense or defense of others. You cant just shoot your neighbor who just stepped in the door to say hello because he is in your house.

The main purpose of most castle doctrine laws is it shifts the onus from the homeowner proving it was self defense to the prosecution proving it wasnt. Second part of most laws is if a shooting is found justified prevents the goblin or its relatives from suing the victim for damages caused by the goblin.

There is no free pass in any state to just blast the crap out of anyone you feel likethat steps in your door regardless of what the media claims

downsouth 01-05-2012 02:43 PM

1 Attachment(s)
I thought this would be useful in this thread

Attachment 36994

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:12 PM.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.