[sgciv]

Finally got to test some .45 acp ammo, figured I would share some results. the pics are not the best, I would rather buy ammo than a new camera. All rounds were fired into water soaked phone books, The rangers penetrated from 7" to 9", the gold dots 5" to 8". All were fired from a distance of 10' from a Taurus PT 145. The top row are Winchester Ranger T 230 grain auto +p , the bottom are Speer Gold Dot 185 grain.

[ta1588]

wow! nice test! looks like the winchester expands more but it does look like the core separates from the jacket. Gold dots look like the jacket stays with the core but doesn't expand as much...tough choice?

[sgciv]

the one gold dot that did expand separated more than the winchesters did. I already ordered more rangers t's, they are the best Ive seen except for federal hst witch are not around anywhere. You can find the Ranger t's for 39.99 per 50 rounds @ ammunitiontogo.com. the gold dots are there to 26.99 per 50 but I like the rangers much better they went deeper and opened faster.

[planenut]

Thanks for posting the results...

How do you do the wet phone book test exactly? Several stacked together to make it 10-12 inches?

[CA357]

Thanks for the pics and info. I used to favor the Gold Dots. However, in the past year or so, I've been switching over to the Rangers, both HP and FMJ.

Thanks for reinforcing my decision.

[superc]

Hmm, may I suggest replicating the test on a slaughtered steer or hog? I suspect the results may flip-flop in different test mediums.

What we have here is an indicator that something happens. Cloth wrapped ballistic jello may also give different results (as will car doors, water filled jugs and wood blocks).

I suspect it is premature to reject one brand or another simply because of phone book tests. If I point a .45, the odds that the target is a wet phone book tend to be slim.

This is an old, historical, problem, one that has been the subject of much debate since the days of the civil war, when the US Army did their first tests on cadavers and determined to their satisfaction that a one inch penetration in fresh pine wood was equivalent to a potentially lethal wound.

[masterPsmith]

Nice report. The Winchester Rangers have always done very well. They are my second choice to the Black Talons that I carry...

Jim........

[sgciv]

I soaked three phonebooks for an hour in a cooler. They are about four inches thick before soaking. I have shot both of these rounds into gallon jugs before, they both went into the third jug and opened up nice and wide. Also tested 230 grain gold dots the same way and they seemed to expand better. I would love to test some Federal HST if anyone knows where they can be found...

[spittinfire]

Originally Posted by sgciv

I soaked three phonebooks for an hour in a cooler. They are about four inches thick before soaking. I have shot both of these rounds into gallon jugs before, they both went into the third jug and opened up nice and wide. Also tested 230 grain gold dots the same way and they seemed to expand better. I would love to test some Federal HST if anyone knows where they can be found...

How about http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f30/spittinfires-ammo-testing-45acp-38-special-sd-loads-budget-hps-21983/

I've been arming my wife with Gold Dots in her 38. After seeing this I may need to do some testing of my own. If they don't perform better then what I'm seeing here, I'll be doing some shopping.

[Gatekeeper]

I did this as well as a few other "45 Caliber Kings" in a bunker thread that was supposed to be a good indication of penetration and expansion using the same test media (wet newspaper) to be fired from the same distance of 7yards.
Would have been a great information resource but only a few who committed to the test actually did it.
Oh well it was a great idea.

Here were my results cut and pasted from the other thread with Federal HST 230gr fired into wet newspaper at 7yds----------------
__________________________________________________ _______

Fed 230gr HST +P @7yd
Kimber SIS Custom 5"

Wanted to get a decent camera before I posted, didn't get one yet so these will have to do.

Fired two shots originally and measured the depth, was surprised by the penetration(or lack of) First shot struck near the paracord I'd wrapped the paper in. The paper was slanted in near the impact point and I think that accounts for the uneven mushroom since there was no sign of any bullets tumbling. Second shot hit paper square.
Shot 1 5 1/4"________ .919" ______183.4 gr retained weight
Shot 2 5 1/2"_________.940"______231.7gr
Thought maybe the paper being bound tight accounted for less penetration than expected. So I cut paracord and shook out the sections of paper and restacked. Fired one more shot and the results were consistent.
Shot 3 5 1/2"________.925"_______230.4gr

Sitting on a quarter

So thats what I got.

I also took the opportunity (a little OT)to fire a few shots from my 16" barreled AR just to see what it would do since I had a discussion in another thread about lack of penetration with .223
I fired 3shots with handloaded 60gr Nosler Ballistic Tips.
They penetrated about an inch at approx caliber size then the expansion became violent and ended in complete fragmentation with total penetration of 7", 7", and 7 1/4"

Not much left to see other than a few pieces of jacket,plastic and the bullets bases. But it did surprise me that these 60gr varmint bullets out penetrated the 230gr HST's.