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-   -   why is this happening? (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f57/why-happening-15112/)

Hot Sauce NARC 06-25-2009 03:13 PM

why is this happening?
 
When i was shooting my new 1911 the other day i had a strange thing happen to me a couple of times. The slide would lock back like on an empty magazine, but there would still be one or two rounds in the mag. I was using brand new wilson combat mags and speer lawman 230gr roundnose ammo. o i forgot the rounds in the mag would be slightly forward, like the rim of the case was about 1/4 of an inch from the back of the mag.

Samples.32 06-25-2009 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hot Sauce NARC (Post 121543)
When i was shooting my new 1911 the other day i had a strange thing happen to me a couple of times. The slide would lock back like on an empty magazine, but there would still be one or two rounds in the mag. I was using brand new wilson combat mags and speer lawman 230gr roundnose ammo. o i forgot the rounds in the mag would be slightly forward, like the rim of the case was about 1/4 of an inch from the back of the mag.


Well, speer isn't exactly the best ammo (good target ammo though) it's possible that the pressure rom the bullets was not hot enough to cycle through properly I had that happen a whole lot using speer ammo in my colt 45.

indy_kid 06-25-2009 03:56 PM

It's cycling...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Samples.32 (Post 121555)
Well, speer isn't exactly the best ammo (good target ammo though) it's possible that the pressure rom the bullets was not hot enough to cycle through properly I had that happen a whole lot using speer ammo in my colt 45.

It's hot enough to push the slide back so that it's locking on what it THINKS is an empty mag.

2 Likely Sources:

1. The lips of the mag are slightly off. Try opening them slightly, making sure the edges are parallel, etc. You might go to your local gun shop, where they should have several other mags you can use for comparison.

2. The feed ramp isn't polished. New ramps can be a little rough from the milling, and some makers may not take the time to properly polish it. Lead bullets can easily snag on the rough surface.

Polish the ramp, and try again with FMJ ammo.

orangello 06-25-2009 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by indy_kid (Post 121559)
2. The feed ramp isn't polished. New ramps can be a little rough from the milling, and some makers may not take the time to properly polish it. Lead bullets can easily snag on the rough surface.

Polish the ramp, and try again with FMJ ammo.

Hotsauce, didn't you have some concerns about the appearance of the ramp, earlier? Dimpled or something?

Hot Sauce NARC 06-25-2009 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangello (Post 121567)
Hotsauce, didn't you have some concerns about the appearance of the ramp, earlier? Dimpled or something?

ya it had some little knicks in the finish it had from the factory, this particular model of kimber had the internal parts coated like the outside and the feed ramp was starting to chip, i polished the finish off of it and got it pretty smooth, but i dont think its hanging up on the feed ramp

Dillinger 06-25-2009 09:05 PM

Hot Sauce - I am inclined to agree that the problem is probably your mag, or the combo of the mag and that ammo. I don't think it's a problem with your weapon.

If the feed ramp was causing the issue, you would get the round part way out of the mag and it hang up going into the chamber.

This sounds like the round isn't even leaving the mag, it's merely being pushed forward enough to cause significant force to lock the slide in place and make it think you have an empty mag.

I would try a couple of different mags before I made any modifications to the weapon itself.

If it starts doing the same thing with each and every mag you try, then I might consider either the strength of the recoil spring, or the feed ramp, but I kind of doubt either of those are really your problem...

JD

Hot Sauce NARC 06-25-2009 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dillinger (Post 121654)
Hot Sauce - I am inclined to agree that the problem is probably your mag, or the combo of the mag and that ammo. I don't think it's a problem with your weapon.

If the feed ramp was causing the issue, you would get the round part way out of the mag and it hang up going into the chamber.

This sounds like the round isn't even leaving the mag, it's merely being pushed forward enough to cause significant force to lock the slide in place and make it think you have an empty mag.

I would try a couple of different mags before I made any modifications to the weapon itself.

If it starts doing the same thing with each and every mag you try, then I might consider either the strength of the recoil spring, or the feed ramp, but I kind of doubt either of those are really your problem...

JD


Thanks JD the first 50-60 rounds i fired i had this happen about once a mag, but after about 200 rounds it stopped happening as much and toward the end it didnt happen at all so maybe the mags were just tight and theyll get better with more ammo so ill just try and shoot the problems out of it :Dand if it keeps happening ill try to rediagnose.

Dillinger 06-26-2009 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hot Sauce NARC (Post 121661)
Thanks JD the first 50-60 rounds i fired i had this happen about once a mag, but after about 200 rounds it stopped happening as much and toward the end it didnt happen at all so maybe the mags were just tight and theyll get better with more ammo so ill just try and shoot the problems out of it :Dand if it keeps happening ill try to rediagnose.

Depending on the Model of 1911, there are those that will tell you that you need to expend 500 or 600 rounds through a 1911 to get it "broken in".

I have never prescribed to this theory - but the first 1911 I purchased was a Kimber - so I kind of jumped into the deep end.

I have heard this "500 or 600" round clear up plenty of 1911's from certain manufacturers, so I would be interested to hear of your final thoughts on the issue.

There is nothing wrong with extra practice, but to "plan" on a weapon needing that kind of "work" before it is reliable has always puzzled me.

I will be looking forward to your updates - please keep us informed!

JD

canebrake 06-26-2009 02:07 AM

Does the problem happen with the Kimber mags?

Slide lock-back is simple mechanics, mag follower rises to the empty position and contacts the lock forcing it up into the slide's lock relief on its final recoil.

That's why I only use mags with metal followers that make that important contact point.

Hot Sauce NARC 06-26-2009 02:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by canebrake (Post 121807)
Does the problem happen with the Kimber mags?

Slide lock-back is simple mechanics, mag follower rises to the empty position and contacts the lock forcing it up into the slide's lock relief on its final recoil.

That's why I only use mags with metal followers that make that important contact point.

I havent tried the kimber mag i will next time to see what happens

i did go into a gunsmith this evening and he looked at it, and played with it for a while, and he said it may be the spring holds tension on the slide lock may need to be stretched a little bit providing more tension. He said that on the 6th or 7th shot when the slide recoils if there was not enough tension on that spring the slide lock could flip up and lock the slide back.


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