Why aren't 1911s fitted with a decocker instead of a manual safety? - Page 9
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Why aren't 1911s fitted with a decocker instead of a manual safety?


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Old 06-10-2012, 04:07 PM   #81
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Have you ever owned a 1911? Everyone I know that shoots mine are sold on them. It is a solid design with minimal changes over the last 100 years. The manual safety allows you to carry "cocked and locked" without the worry of shooting yourself. The grip safety is nice but wouldn't do too much when drawing the weapon since you are grabbing the grip. I do not know about anyone else's 1911, but it is way easier to hit my thumb safety from the draw then pull the hammer all the way back again.
Highlighted for FACT!!! I have YET to have someone ( that hadnt previously shot a 1911) squeeze off a magazine from my 1911 and NOT; One) walk away in love, Two) offer to buy it on the spot, Three) immediately begin shopping for their own 1911
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Old 06-10-2012, 04:09 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by fmj

Highlighted for FACT!!! I have YET to have someone ( that hadnt previously shot a 1911) squeeze off a magazine from my 1911 and NOT; One) walk away in love, Two) offer to buy it on the spot, Three) immediately begin shopping for their own 1911
First 1911 I shot was a Taurus 9mm.
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Old 06-10-2012, 04:34 PM   #83
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First 1911 I shot was a Taurus 9mm.
If you had read the post by Kalash you would understand that, that isnt, in fact, a 1911!!

1911 are chambered in 45 acp PERIOD!!
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Old 06-10-2012, 04:48 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fmj

Highlighted for FACT!!! I have YET to have someone ( that hadnt previously shot a 1911) squeeze off a magazine from my 1911 and NOT; One) walk away in love, Two) offer to buy it on the spot, Three) immediately begin shopping for their own 1911
Hell the last person that shot my 1911 forced me to the LGS with him so he could get one just like mine

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Old 06-10-2012, 05:06 PM   #85
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The thumb (side) safety as well as the grip safety are both manual safeties. It takes a manual-at-arms (manual action) to both engage and disengage them....let's get it right. On some recent designs there are 1 or 2 additional internal auto engaging safeties.

Condition 1 and condition 3 are preferred for carry, condition 2 and condition 4 are not.

The half cock hammer position (not really a full half) wasn't designed for carry, it is a throw back to the SAA designs and in part for catching the hammer if the thumb prematurely slips off the hammer when going from condition 2 to condition 1.

I think if you research the history, we would find that the military went through many modes of carry and qualification with the 1911, including condition 1 (favored in combat), as well as condition 2 and 3 favored for range and peacetime training/qualification, as well as condition 4 for peacetime carry (firearms were carried unloaded during guard duty at most stations, unless under alert).

A properly maintained/configured 1911 DOES NOT have a hair trigger. If a 1911 has a hair trigger (less than 2 pounds) it has been adjusted beyond the safe range of the design.

The 1911 does have a decocker. It's a manual decocker, manual-at-arms, using similar manual actions as engaging/disengaging the safeties.

The 1911 also has one additional manual safety, which is the identical safety found on every other brand, model, shape, design handgun......your trigger finger connected to your gray mass between the ears.

The 1911 was designed and adopted by the military with certain features and functions in mind for use by the lowest denominator (maybe like the OP). The 1911 design isn't perfect......it's about as perfect as John Browning was permitted at the time.

.
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Old 06-10-2012, 05:24 PM   #86
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pretty good EagleSix! the part about the finger and it being attached to the brain being the safety that is part of every firearm made is true. the person using the firearm is the most important safety there is. the makers of firearms can add or delete all the safeties they want to, but the person operating the firearm has the ultimate control over that operation and how safely it's done.
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Old 06-10-2012, 08:35 PM   #87
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The grip safty as stated before, was added to make the gun "Safer" for calvary troops.

My understanding is, it disconects the trigger bar from the sear, While the thumb safty actualy locks the hammer in place.

The two items actual do different things mechanicly, and serve 2 separate purposes.

The "Safe" notch is designed to catch the hammer incase the sear disengages without the trigger being pulled. Many people eronously believe the gun is designed to be carried in the "safe" notch. It is not the gun should be carried either cocked and locked or with the hammer down.

By using the "safe" notch, you take a chance of wearing it to a point where it will fail to catch a accidentaly falling hammer.

1911 also have a curious tendancy to "double" because the weight of the trigger carries enough inertia to fire the gun under recoil, if the spings are worn or if some jack ball did your trigger work. You will notice on "target" 1911s, they have skelotonised triggers, this is done not only to look bad ass but to lighten the trigger eliminating some of its inertia.

The grip safty is designed to disengage the trigger because a dropped 1911 can have enough inertia to activate the trigger, especially if it was dropped from a galloping horse.

Decoking bars were added to autos, to aid people in making their guns "safe" with shacky adrenaline filled hands. They aren't neccesary on a 1911, because the thumb safty locks the hammer in place anyway.

So if you drop a series 80 or newr 1911 with the thumb safty engaged it will not go off unless, the thumb safty fails, the safe notch fails, the fireing pin lock fails, and finally the grip safty will prevent an enteria firing by the trigger if nothing else works.

Prior to the series 80 pistol, it was possible for a 1911 to fire if drop because of firing pin inertia although it is not likely.
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Old 06-10-2012, 08:58 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EagleSix View Post
The thumb (side) safety as well as the grip safety are both manual safeties. It takes a manual-at-arms (manual action) to both engage and disengage them....let's get it right. On some recent designs there are 1 or 2 additional internal auto engaging safeties.

Condition 1 and condition 3 are preferred for carry, condition 2 and condition 4 are not.

The half cock hammer position (not really a full half) wasn't designed for carry, it is a throw back to the SAA designs and in part for catching the hammer if the thumb prematurely slips off the hammer when going from condition 2 to condition 1.

I think if you research the history, we would find that the military went through many modes of carry and qualification with the 1911, including condition 1 (favored in combat), as well as condition 2 and 3 favored for range and peacetime training/qualification, as well as condition 4 for peacetime carry (firearms were carried unloaded during guard duty at most stations, unless under alert).

A properly maintained/configured 1911 DOES NOT have a hair trigger. If a 1911 has a hair trigger (less than 2 pounds) it has been adjusted beyond the safe range of the design.

The 1911 does have a decocker. It's a manual decocker, manual-at-arms, using similar manual actions as engaging/disengaging the safeties.

The 1911 also has one additional manual safety, which is the identical safety found on every other brand, model, shape, design handgun......your trigger finger connected to your gray mass between the ears.

The 1911 was designed and adopted by the military with certain features and functions in mind for use by the lowest denominator (maybe like the OP). The 1911 design isn't perfect......it's about as perfect as John Browning was permitted at the time.

.
I like to call that the "adjustable nut behind the trigger" safety feature.

Keep your damn finger OFF the trigger and OUT of the trigger guard housing until ready to shoot!!!
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Old 06-11-2012, 01:23 AM   #89
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Me- "Is this thread dead?"
Grandpa- "Hold on" pulls out CZ 75 *BANG* "yep, looks dead to me"
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Old 06-11-2012, 01:28 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenney
Me- "Is this thread dead?"
Grandpa- "Hold on" pulls out CZ 75 *BANG* "yep, looks dead to me"
Its been bloated and stinkin for quite some time
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