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-   -   Remington r1 vs ??? (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f57/remington-r1-vs-81496/)

Crazyape 01-16-2013 02:15 PM

Remington r1 vs ???
 
OK guys I'm new at this whole thing but I want to learn everything I can. Here is my question.. What is the difference between standard 1911's (r1) and the high end 11's (wilson combat, kimber, etc...)? I have a history in paintball, and I am a car builder and painter, so I understand smaller, faster, lighter, and pretty paint but is there any actual performance or quality benafits?

JonM 01-16-2013 02:29 PM

Depends on your philosophy of use.

To me the high end 1911's are nice and all but they deviate from the military spec and dont lend well to defensive role. They tend to have all the slop and play removed from frame to slide to barrel linkages. This means just a little bit of harsh abuse or dirt can lock em up solid when you need them the most.

Under range conditions its a nonissue. Under conditions where dirt or lack of lubricant is involved (the goblin isnt going to give you time to oil your gun) tight tolerances us a very bad thing.

If your doing bullseye and such you want solid lockup to drive rounds on top of each other. In self defense you dont need laser accuracy so you want a little slop to ensure reliability. 1-2 inch groups from a lower end gun is more than adequate for self defense.

Ive owned high end 1911s and while they are very very nice to target shoot with they suck as everyday carry guns.

Both types have their purpose. There is no one gun thats perfect for every role.

Just my opinion.

danf_fl 01-16-2013 02:49 PM

Welcome to the forum. We have an "Introductions" area where you can say "Hi".

As you are a car builder, you know that some parts from company "a" will work, but the same part from company "b" works better. If you are talking model cars, then the replica from company "c" is more true to the original than company "d".

So is it in the world of firearms. Some 1911s are assembled with just enough attention to be able to work and be called a 1911. Others go the extra mile to make sure they have what is considered the "Best" 1911.

JonM 01-16-2013 03:16 PM

Oh one other thing. Dan brought up the car thing which made this analogy pop in mind. Whats better a chevy nova or a indy car?? indy cars kinda suck if you need to take the kids to chuckeecheese but you arent going to win any indy races with a chevy nova...

Olympus 01-16-2013 03:37 PM

There are several differences aside from the obvious. Since you like cars, what's the difference between a Chevy Aveo and a Cadillac CTS? Both are dependable cars that get you from point A to point B. One is just built to higher standards with better quality parts and has more style. But either one will perform their primary function more or less the same.

Same applies to the gun world. The Remington will go BOOM just as reliably as a higher end gun. Just depends on whether what you want is something that will strictly go BOOM, or if you want something extra.

Crazyape 01-16-2013 05:05 PM

Ok I'm following along heres what I got.
First off Aveo vs cadillac are different platforms.. 1911 vs ar15 .. but that being said a four banger mustang and a roush mustang are vastly different based in there some of parts. Will any part upgrades affect my r1, or is the standard of fabrication limiting the overall performance in comparison? I'm assuming that an " aftermarket" trigger or guide springs will not fit any better or make a noticable improvement on my r1.

Olympus 01-16-2013 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazyape
Ok I'm following along heres what I got.
First off Aveo vs cadillac are different platforms.. 1911 vs ar15 .. but that being said a four banger mustang and a roush mustang are vastly different based in there some of parts. Will any part upgrades affect my r1, or is the standard of fabrication limiting the overall performance in comparison? I'm assuming that an " aftermarket" trigger or guide springs will not fit any better or make a noticable improvement on my r1.

You follow the Nova vs Indy car comparison, but say mine are a different platform? #scratch?

As far as certain part upgrades, some will make moderate improvements and others very little if any. What result are you wanting to achieve? What are you wanting your R1 to do or do better? If you are wanting super tight accuracy, then you will be limited based on the tolerances of your gun. It is very difficult to "tighten" tolerances.

As far as the trigger, changing that will have very little affect on performance. You want a lighter, smoother trigger then you should focus on the sear engagement, hammer, and leaf spring instead just the trigger. These will all need to be properly fit and mated by someone competent. Whereas the guide spring you mention should drop in no matter the gun.

JonM 01-16-2013 06:37 PM

guide rods in the 1911 actually reduce reliability while adding nothing to the accuracy equation. you only need a guild rod when you use a much heavier than stock recoil spring to keep it from binding. the problem with the guide rod in 1911's is that they are of two piece design and can easily come apart slightly making the spring hang on the rod itself.

it takes a lot of money to drastically increase the accuracy of a stock 1911. even the cheapest RIA 1911 base model is a more accurate handgun than 99% of the people who own guns can shoot one.

people buy more pricey guns with higher quality parts and better craftsmanship for the same exact reason we all want better cars. every car on the market will get you to walmart but a ferrari testarosa does it in style...

danf_fl 01-16-2013 06:45 PM

Take a glass pack muffler and see how many brands there are.
Thrush, Flowmaster, Magnaflow, stock.

Each do the same thing, but to different degrees. Just dropping a Rousch engine in place of a 4 cyl does not make an efficient race car. As with cars, when one thing is changed, other things may need to be changed also.

The knowledge of what needs to be changed separates good from great.

limbkiller 01-16-2013 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonM (Post 1096194)
Depends on your philosophy of use.

To me the high end 1911's are nice and all but they deviate from the military spec and dont lend well to defensive role. They tend to have all the slop and play removed from frame to slide to barrel linkages. This means just a little bit of harsh abuse or dirt can lock em up solid when you need them the most.

Under range conditions its a nonissue. Under conditions where dirt or lack of lubricant is involved (the goblin isnt going to give you time to oil your gun) tight tolerances us a very bad thing.

If your doing bullseye and such you want solid lockup to drive rounds on top of each other. In self defense you dont need laser accuracy so you want a little slop to ensure reliability. 1-2 inch groups from a lower end gun is more than adequate for self defense.

Ive owned high end 1911s and while they are very very nice to target shoot with they suck as everyday carry guns.

Both types have their purpose. There is no one gun thats perfect for every role.

Just my opinion.

Well that's bullcrap. Tell Chuck Rodgers that his lockup tight no rattle guns won't work when the dust blows a little. Call Joe Chambers and tell him the same thing and he will laugh in your face. Personally I don't mind a little rattle as I just buy guns as an investment and to shoot. But well put together 1911's are so much smoother, accurate and just plan fun to shoot. It's like driving a 65 fast back mustang and a built Shelby. And no you don't need extreme accuracy for a carry pistol, but if you have the dough go for it. You will have a gun that will run as good as any sloppy gun. Sheech!!


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