Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > Handguns > Semi-Auto Handguns > 1911 Forum > 1911 Clone Safety Question

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-17-2013, 06:54 AM   #1
Concealed Carry Instructor
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
AR10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lincoln Nebraska
Posts: 1,944
Liked 882 Times on 588 Posts
Likes Given: 224

Default 1911 Clone Safety Question

Some 1911 clones, the safety locks in the down hammer position, or first click position, as well as cocked and locked.

An example would be a Star PD.

What other 1911 clones have other than standard 1911 safeties?

Interested in a 1911 style 45 , but not a fan of the safety. I had a Star PD years ago, and I prefer the safety on that.

Also, is it possible to modify 1911s to lock hammer on first click?

__________________
AR10 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote

Join FirearmsTalk.com Today - It's Free!

Are you a firearms enthusiast? Then we hope you will join the community. You will gain access to post, create threads, private message, upload images, join groups and more.

Firearms Talk is owned and operated by fellow firearms enthusiasts. We strive to offer a non-commercial community to learn and share information.

Join FirearmsTalk.com Today! - Click Here


Old 07-17-2013, 10:16 AM   #2
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
austin92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Indiana
Posts: 825
Liked 181 Times on 134 Posts

Default

My Rock Island will only engage the safety with the hammer fully back

__________________
austin92 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2013, 11:17 AM   #3
Retired
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
danf_fl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: LA (Lower Alabama),FL
Posts: 10,063
Liked 2665 Times on 1551 Posts
Likes Given: 1182

Default

The 1911 (as a SA semi-auto) is not designed to work in that fashion.
The thumb safety is designed to block movement of the sear. Can you change it to function when the hammer is down? Yes, but with parts that could compromise the reliability of the 1911 (cutouts in sear, and some other things).

The 1911 hammer is normally carried in the down postion if there is not a round in the chamber, which renders the firearm safe already.

Although some do it, it is not a recommendation to carry a 1911 with hammer down and have a round in the chamber. To put the hammer down on a loaded chamber requires that the trigger be pulled (and one firearm safety rule is to keep you finger off the trigger until on target and ready to fire).

__________________

Amendment II:
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Life Member NRA
Life Member NAHC
Former President of the ECPT (Eifel Combat Pistol Team)

danf_fl is offline  
Axxe55 Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2013, 11:33 AM   #4
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
SSGN_Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 4,126
Liked 1976 Times on 1174 Posts
Likes Given: 424

Default

Are you wanting to be able to cycle the slide with the safety engaged? I'm confused about "first click". My 1911s only have two safety positions, up or down, with only one click to either position. The hammer has three basic positions, down, half-cocked, fully cocked. A 1911 would only lock in the fully cockedx position, and the slide is blocked from cycling when the safety is engaged.

There was a modification to the slide that would allow the slide to be cycled while the safety is engaged and the hammer is back,

I don't know of a modification that would allow the manual safety to be engaged while at half-cocked. But the half-cocked notch on the hammer of the 1911 is much more substantial than the sear notch, some even have a capture lip on them that come over the back side of the sear edge, so if it is in half-cock it isn't going anywhere. The problem is that to disengage from half-cock you need to partly cock it and pul the trigger. So the chamber MUST be empty when doing this so that a slip at this point doesn't result in a negligent discharge.

__________________

Last edited by SSGN_Doc; 07-17-2013 at 11:35 AM.
SSGN_Doc is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2013, 11:36 AM   #5
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
HOSSFLY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lufkin,Tx
Posts: 6,932
Liked 2176 Times on 1468 Posts
Likes Given: 1191

Default

NO true 1911 clone safety will work in any manner other than full cock position---
The Star PD is one of the many 1911-inspired style pistols-NOT a clone or really that close to one -
IMHO altering the safety on any gun is just begging for a bad ending

__________________

Texan By Birth & Choice
USMC/VIET NAM VET

HOSSFLY is offline  
Axxe55 Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2013, 12:31 PM   #6
Concealed Carry Instructor
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
AR10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lincoln Nebraska
Posts: 1,944
Liked 882 Times on 588 Posts
Likes Given: 224

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HOSSFLY View Post
NO true 1911 clone safety will work in any manner other than full cock position---
The Star PD is one of the many 1911-inspired style pistols-NOT a clone or really that close to one -
IMHO altering the safety on any gun is just begging for a bad ending
OK, what other" inspired" pistols have a safety that engages the slide locked and hammer cocked or not cocked? Example: Star PD.

Looked at an earlier Para Ordenance P12 yesterday. Price was right, $475, but I could not get my mind around the safety being cocked and locked only. Had the safety opperated like my old Star PD, I would have ticked the wife off and adopted another gun.
__________________
AR10 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2013, 12:48 PM   #7
Moderator
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
JonM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rochester WI,Rochester WI
Posts: 17,206
Liked 5323 Times on 2779 Posts
Likes Given: 336

Default

What your describing is usually found on military handguns from the 1920's to 1950's with an emphasis on military sales to various nations.

What your looking at is design features that militaries like to use wherre the pistolis more of a uniform decoration or purely a sign of station. The need to make the pistol as difficult to get into action for such a role is why that feature is desired by such units or armies.

Some notable designs are the tokarev and makarov cz75 berreta 92 early design with frame mounted safety and others

__________________

"Gun control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound." — L. Neil Smith

The problem with being stupid is you cannot simply decide to stop doing dumb things...

JonM is online now  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2013, 04:32 PM   #8
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Thebiker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Phoenix East Valley, AZ,Arizona
Posts: 288
Liked 27 Times on 20 Posts

Default

If condition 1 is worrisome to you, perhaps the 1911 platform is not the best choice for you.

One option that pops to mind is a pistol with a decocker. Allows for a round in the chamber with the hammer safely down. The first trigger pull is DA but subsequent shots are SA in many cases. Sig classic series (P226, 229, 220etc) comes to mind as well a a couple of CZ models.

Just my thoughts on a personal preference.YMMV.

__________________
Walt

If I have to explain it, you probably won't understand it.
Thebiker is offline  
qwiksdraw Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2013, 04:46 PM   #9
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
SSGN_Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 4,126
Liked 1976 Times on 1174 Posts
Likes Given: 424

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AR10 View Post
OK, what other" inspired" pistols have a safety that engages the slide locked and hammer cocked or not cocked? Example: Star PD.

Looked at an earlier Para Ordenance P12 yesterday. Price was right, $475, but I could not get my mind around the safety being cocked and locked only. Had the safety opperated like my old Star PD, I would have ticked the wife off and adopted another gun.
The Smith and Wesson M39 , M59 series autos had some different safeties that would allow different safe settings with the hammer down, but these are only lightly 1911 "inspired", and are DA/SA instead of SA autos.
__________________
SSGN_Doc is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Firearms Forum Replies Last Post
1911 beaver tail safety KY1911 Gunsmithing Forum 13 03-23-2012 07:55 AM
HELP me reinstall ambi safety 1911 CHLChris 1911 Forum 6 07-16-2011 12:21 AM
CA94 mp5 clone 9mm ammo question ARnoob Auto & Semi-Auto Discussion 2 03-18-2009 08:29 PM
Anyone had or heard of a Laseraim (1911 clone) dgray64 1911 Forum 0 08-09-2008 10:39 PM
1911 Clone huckleberry General Handgun Discussion 14 07-25-2008 06:16 AM