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Old 11-12-2010, 04:41 AM   #1
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Default Why Glock and Why a 9mm

This guy pretty much explains why he went with Glock and 9mm. If you got a few minutes, give it a read, it's got some good points.

Why Glock, Why 9mm? [2005] - 03DESIGNGROUP

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Old 11-12-2010, 08:55 AM   #2
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Default Good Read

Sir; a very good read Thanks for sharing

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Old 11-13-2010, 04:06 AM   #3
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Thanks for posting that. I agree.

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Old 11-14-2010, 04:19 AM   #4
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im not sure i agree with some of the reasoning. the point about caliber not mattering. by what criteria were the survive no survive measured or was it just the authers interpretation?? if his point is true why not a .380 or 38spl both are far far easier shooting rounds and same diameter as 9mm?? why bother with the expense and risk of jams and under penetration of hollow points when diameter doesnt mean anything?? a lot of the logic really doesnt carry.

as far as carrying and shooting something that works for you is a real good idea. i agree with that, but i disagree with the logic in how he got there.

from my experience the weight of the bullet is pretty important. the bigger the diameter and the more the bullet weighs determines the effectiveness of the round.

my 458 winmag using 350 grain bullets at 1900-2000fps it isnt nearly as effective hunting as a 520 grain bullet at the same fps. only thing different is the weight. the effects on the heart lung area of hogs and deer are vastly different. i would assume this is the same correlation as pistol bullet weight only on a MUCH smaller scale.

shooting paper all day and your gonna want a 22 instead of a 9mm or 45acp. by the logic of the linked poster it would be better to use a 22lr since its really easier to be more accurate with a 22 than a 9mm and after all your just punching holes not tearing sht up.

personally ill go with the 45acp every slight advantage i can get may mean the diff tween life and death. i do know for a fact that critters bleed faster with a 45 cal hole than they do with a 30 cal hole when hunting.

if i can only land one round and hide i want the hole to be as big as possible.

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Old 11-14-2010, 04:58 AM   #5
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Bigger hole =more blood loss. You betcha. However, I read a great article by Chuck Taylor in the new issue of Combat Handguns. About his 20+ year old Glock 17. He fired 10,000 rounds without cleaning before malfunction, and fired 277,000 rounds before a parts failure. Worth reading. I am not cheerleading, don't own a Glock. Shot one once, it was accurate but I just don't care for the feel of them. Too bad, I'd like to have a 20, reasonably priced 10mm, but I just don't like it. Have to save my sheckels for a Colt or Kimber.

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Old 11-14-2010, 05:26 AM   #6
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The point of the article was that 9mm works, and that Glocks are simple and consistent to use.

While a .45 is more effective than a 9mm, the placement of the hole is the important part. A .45 hole in the wrong place is not more effective than a 9mm hole in the right place. A 9mm hole through the center of the sternum is just as effective as a .45 hole.

And the ability to put numerous 9mm holes into multiple targets is a big plus.

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Old 11-14-2010, 06:32 AM   #7
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It depends on how wrong of a place. They key factor for me in any pistol caliber is stopping power. From my experience stopping power and hydrostatic shock and temporary and permant cavitation are very closely linked. As a .45 has a significantly largly hydrostatic shock diameter as well as temporary and permanant cavitation diameter, a .45 has much more stopping power than a 9mm. .45's also seem to experience over penetration less often as they travel at a lower speed and have a larger surface area than a 9mm... Which could be responsible for alot of the extra stopping power as more of the energy is directed into the target instead of at whatever is behind the target. For example: If i where to hit someone in the upper right side of their chest, in the meaty part above the right lung and just below the colar bone, it would still colapse their right lung and deal irreperable damage to their lower trachea and possbily a collapsed left lung (as well as many other damaged organs and neurological damages). To achieve these same results with a 9mm would require a nearly perfect shot just below the trachea and between both lungs... basicly in the middle of their sturnum.

The primary reason for this is the effects of hydrostatic shock. Imagine a tidal wave traveling across a persons flesh and you have a good idea of what i am talking about. This "tidal wave" will massively damage any organ it reaches virtually destroying it. The .45 has a much higher balistic pressure wave (hydrostatic shock) than a 9mm does on average.

When comparing the same type of ammunition (Cor-Bon JHP) for both the 9mm parabellum and the .45 acp. (BPW= balistic presure wave AIT= average incapacitation time)

9mm
energy ft/lb: 465
penetration: 14.2 inches
BPW: 626 psi
permanant cavitation: 3.4 cubic inches
AIT: 8.8 seconds

.45
energy ft/lb:544
penetration: 11.3 inches
BPW:920 psi
permanant cavitation: 4.4 cubic inches
AIT: 7.2 seconds

We can see that the .45 does everything you want a round for self defence to do better than the 9mm does.

I am not knocking the 9mm, as the lowered recoil does allow for faster follow up shots and it does allow for larger capacity magazines. However when comparing round for round, the .45 is hands down a far superior round. Also just to compare and maybe put a little knowledge into your mind here are the stats for a .40 cal (Cor-Bon JHP)

.40
energy ft/lb:507
penetration: 9.8 inches
BPW: 1384 psi
permanant cavitation:2.4 cubic inches
AIT: 5.9 seconds

The major downside of the .40 is that it lacks very much permanant cavitation and therefore is not nearly as effective when impacting a limb as the 9mm and .45 are. But maybe if you cant decide between a 9mm and a .45 you should consider the .40 cal.

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Old 11-14-2010, 06:32 AM   #8
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"Choose the platform and caliber best suits you based on comfort, ergonomics, personal preferences, and what you shoot with the best. Don't get married to a platform or caliber just because you preceive it's cool or because you have a lot of money invested in your firearm or equipment."

Good little writeup. I don't own a Glock (prefer XD) and I have as many 45's as 9's...but valid points all around.

Own whatever you want. Shoot whatever you want. But for carry, and to rely on for defense, favor the platform you've demonstrated high competence with.
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Old 11-14-2010, 06:45 AM   #9
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"I couldn't think of a single shooting where the person or animal was shot with a 9mm and lived, but would have died if the round would have been a .40S&W or a .45acp. And I could not think of a single shooting where a person or animal was shot with a .40S&W or a .45acp and died, but would have survived if the round would have been a 9mm."


That's the smartest thing I've read in a while. Finally someone who understands that the .45 and .40 aren't magical one stop shot bullets. This guy knows his stuff.

9mm is an effective self defense round. Nuff said.
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Old 11-14-2010, 06:58 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indyfan View Post
"I couldn't think of a single shooting where the person or animal was shot with a 9mm and lived, but would have died if the round would have been a .40S&W or a .45acp. And I could not think of a single shooting where a person or animal was shot with a .40S&W or a .45acp and died, but would have survived if the round would have been a 9mm."


That's the smartest thing I've read in a while. Finally someone who understands that the .45 and .40 aren't magical one stop shot bullets. This guy knows his stuff.

9mm is an effective self defense round. Nuff said.
No one has said the 9mm is not an effective self defence round. However as this man stated himself he thinks the wounds would have been no different. Science has shown otherwise. I will chose proven fact over 1 mans opinion every day.
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