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Old 04-05-2014, 02:00 PM   #91
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The point of plastic is not its comparative strength. It is weight, corrosion resistance, maintenance, and cost. Every Glock is a combat pistol. Everything is modular and interchangeable. Most 1911's today are highly detailed personal use firearms.
You make a few good points. Saying that the point of plastic is not its comparative strength, does that not express the assumption that a steel 1911 could be stronger just by material comparison? Including that between the two materials, it is easier to achieve a tight tolerance from steel than it is from a plastic injection mold process, would that in itself not be a means of a more efficient and possibly more accurate firearm?
Weight, I would have to agree on because 1911's are slightly on the heavy side.
Being more corrosion resistant is correct, but in my opinion not by a huge margin. The parts on a Glock that are considered more corrosion resistant, I like to comparatively refer to on a 1911 as more heat resistant. :P
I do not necessarily understand the maintenance part of your statement, in regards to a firearm at least. Am I to believe that a Glock is never in need of being cleaned and maintained on the basis that it has a polymer frame? I take care of all of my firearms the same, even the polymer ones.
Out of curiosity, what makes all Glocks combat ready moreso than a 1911, or any other firearm for that matter? Really, I dont know........ I would personally think that any firearm with a loaded mag and one in the chamber could be considered a combat pistol. I can see debates on calibers and weight grains, but other than that Im at a loss. I would lean to believe Mr. Browning had some kind of intent when designing the 1911. Even the highly detailed personal use ones. Dont think that I wouldnt grab a $6000 Christensen arms 1911 in a SHTF situation, I guarantee it would be a combat ready pistol, just as your Glock is more than likely for personal use now.
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Old 04-05-2014, 02:40 PM   #92
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As to the points of maintenance reduction for polymer vs. steel would relate to having to protect it from corrosion in different elements. It is not necessary to get a coat of oil on all surfaces and in every nook and cranny in a coastal environment, for example. Polymer may be considered a broadly tolerant material for different environments, that requires less variation in maintenance protocol. The Glock design in particular with its modular trigger and total of 34 parts does make it logistically easier to maintain in a large scale issue weapon environment, and armorer training requirements are greatly reduced, as are logistical expenses in tools, parts weight, and support equipment when you get into large, mobile deployable forces.

The 1911 at its outset was, and in its basic form, is a combat ready pistol. I interpreted the "personal use" statement as one reflecting how the 1911 has evolved to a point where there is a spectrum of formats ranging from simple to highly specialized target pistols. There were "wadcutter" guns, "hardball" guns, optic ready guns, etc.

In fairness though the Glock aftermarket range of configurations is just as wide.

Both guns fit a wide variety of applications.

I also fall into the category of really liking both guns for their positive attributes.

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Old 04-05-2014, 03:01 PM   #93
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This thread has been educational.
I have learned so many new things.

One thing I haven't seen mentioned in this thread is 'Glock Leg'
oh... that and 'Booger Hook' and 'Bang Switch'' there is no AD only ND'

Hopefully this will help wrap this thread up/

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Old 04-05-2014, 03:08 PM   #94
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The fact that this debate rages on and always will proved that both guns are good,glock and the 1911 are here to stay and both have there cons right along with there pros and for all the naysayers if glock was not a good gun why is it the only gun that is ever compared to the 1911?
I like both I have both and after 30+ years I feel glock had proven it's self and the market tends to agree.
And another note for the ”glock leg" conspiracy guys if that were a real issue with the amount of glock in the world bring used by 40+ countries from military to police there and civilians there would be someone shooting themselves everyday, let's stop the bs the only things so far I've seen anyone come up with is there ugly there square they don't fit my hand and they don't have a safety.
These are reasons to not buy a gun but to use that as an excuse to bash a gun well than we could do that all day to lots of guns.

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Old 04-05-2014, 03:27 PM   #95
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....
And another note for the ”glock leg" conspiracy guys..

Well, by Golly, you can use a Glock for fishing
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Old 04-05-2014, 03:36 PM   #96
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Well, by Golly, you can use a Glock for fishing
I do I carry my glock everywhere when I'm carrying it and when I go fishing it is very sandy so yah I like the glock for this environment.
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Old 04-05-2014, 03:36 PM   #97
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I'll add that no one mentioned Tex Grebner with regard to 1911 leg either.

Or wait, did I just mention it by mentioning that no one mentioned it?

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Old 04-05-2014, 04:36 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by Quentin View Post
Gaston Glock and his "Perfection" ad campaign are by far the most annoying things about the company and its products. The gun itself is excellent but the design borrows heavily from earlier designs, including the 1911. The main attributes of the Glock are reliability, simplicity, durability, wide availability of factory/aftermarket parts, light weight and a reasonable price. When choosing a defensive handgun there are plenty of competing designs that work fine but it's wise to include Glock on your short list.

Gaston, his Koolaid Kids and Polymer Pups running around spiking the football probably turn off as many prospective buyers as they convince. I had a negative opinion of Glock for 20+ years until I got one.

The above tool analogy is a good one - it's not a bad idea to have a Glock in the toolbox, it is useful for certain tasks.
My negative opinion comes from the crappy trigger pull, polygon barrel restricting bullet types, excessively unsupported chambers sacrificing safety for supposed reliabilty, bad grip angle making it necessary to under cut the throat for feeding, and observing the average joe with them on ranges having issues with fte ftf stovepipes on regular basis.

Yes I have a number of 1911's but I seldom carry them. My main carry guns have been sigp220, beretta 92's, xdm's... recently picked up a fnx45 that when I find a holster I like will be a carry gun.

Issues I don't like about 1911's is mainly the thin backstrap. This amplifies recoil forces making them less than pleasent to shoot and very difficult to shoot accurately quickly. Weight is another issue and until recently with the newer alloy and aluminum frames coming on colt versions were rather anchorish. When you do go lighter frame a 1911 really starts to punish the shooting hand.

Yes the 1911 is a great gun but its a very dated one. The glock is not a good design and highly overated by propoganda mainly put out by glock...

Better guns out there than both of these.
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Old 04-05-2014, 04:48 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1turkeyhunter View Post
You make a few good points. Saying that the point of plastic is not its comparative strength, does that not express the assumption that a steel 1911 could be stronger just by material comparison? Including that between the two materials, it is easier to achieve a tight tolerance from steel than it is from a plastic injection mold process, would that in itself not be a means of a more efficient and possibly more accurate firearm?
Weight, I would have to agree on because 1911's are slightly on the heavy side.
Being more corrosion resistant is correct, but in my opinion not by a huge margin. The parts on a Glock that are considered more corrosion resistant, I like to comparatively refer to on a 1911 as more heat resistant. :P
I do not necessarily understand the maintenance part of your statement, in regards to a firearm at least. Am I to believe that a Glock is never in need of being cleaned and maintained on the basis that it has a polymer frame? I take care of all of my firearms the same, even the polymer ones.
Out of curiosity, what makes all Glocks combat ready moreso than a 1911, or any other firearm for that matter? Really, I dont know........ I would personally think that any firearm with a loaded mag and one in the chamber could be considered a combat pistol. I can see debates on calibers and weight grains, but other than that Im at a loss. I would lean to believe Mr. Browning had some kind of intent when designing the 1911. Even the highly detailed personal use ones. Dont think that I wouldnt grab a $6000 Christensen arms 1911 in a SHTF situation, I guarantee it would be a combat ready pistol, just as your Glock is more than likely for personal use now.
Of course Glocks need maintenance like any gun, but not necessarily as frequent and thorough as a 1911. (Let's remember btw that Glock is a brand, 1911 is a design, so every face-to-face comparison is a little flawed.)

The 1911 is more complex internally, breaks down in more parts. It has perhaps a higher potential for speedy and super accurate shooting, but that comes at extra cost.
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Old 04-05-2014, 04:58 PM   #100
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a person has to also look at the the time frames in which each was designed. bother were designed with different parameters that reflected the time periods in which they were designed.

neither pistol is perfect and neither were perfect when they were designed. each one has undergone some design changes to some degree over the years.

each one has it's good points each one has it's flaws. those are facts. to be perfectly fair, a person needs to make a choice based on the needs of what one wants a pistol for, not just it's material composition. this is true in regards to which ever pistol a pers chooses. simply put, if a person is looking for lighter weight pistol with high ammo capacity, simply choosing a Glock based on that alone is foolish. there are now many brands that fit those attributes on the market now. that IMO is buying into the market hype. simply buying a 1911 because it's been around for over 100 years and everyone says they are the best because of that, is just as foolish and also buying into the hype.

if i were to own only one pistol to suit a diffferent array of needs i needed a pistol for, it probably would not be a 1911, as much as i like the platform. it probably would not be a Glock either, if i were making the choice to own only one pistol. the Glock is a good choice if it fits a person's needs and it fit them an they can shoot it well. the Glock is a proven design, just as the 1911 is a proven design.

some of the viewpoints and opinions that some make, have to be taken with a grain of salt. many of us older pistol shooters were shooting pistols long before polymers were a construction material for a pistol, and when revolvers were still pretty much common. many of the younger generation came along to pistols when there was huge number of polymer pistols coming onto the market. different generations and age groups with different mindsets to pistols in general.

so when you buy a pistol and if that pistol is the only one you are going to buy, to fit your needs, buy what suites and fits the needs you need it for. don't buy it based on market hype or because of nostagia, but honest needs. also if like me and others, we don't just own one pistol, so we are not as locked into having to make such critical decisions. many older pistols shooters can adapt to different platforms and shoot them well simply from being exposed to and shooting many different types and brands over the years.

in all honesty, i do like giving the Glock Fanboys some ribbing over their devotion to the brand, and a Glock would not be the first choice for me, and i have never owned one personally but have shot many over the years. i can shoot a Glock quite well and accurately at combat and SD ranges. so putting a Glock into my hands would not be putting me at a disadvantage, anymore than putting a 1911 in my hands would, which is a platform i have been shooting probably more than any other over the years. nor than putting a revolver would as well, put me at a disadvantage.

so in a nutshell, choose what suits and fits your needs based on what you need that pistol for. not a brand or just platform. and never base those decisions on market hype of any pistol or brand.

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