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Old 03-21-2014, 03:59 AM   #21
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Sorry I'm kind of confused on how me not liking a gun doesn't "add up"..... I have never shot or carried a 26, so I have no comparison to base that off of, nor did I ever make such comparison. I personally prefer 9mm over .40 due to price, availability, and manageability. I think the majority of my dislike towards the 27 is that being as small as it was, and as heavy as it is, still having the amount of recoil that it had. The recoil from the 27 was manageable, but I would expect a little less being as heavy as it is. Being that the 9mm is not much lighter, I would imagine the decreased recoil would make it better for easier and faster target re-acquisition. Just my guess, as I said I have never fired nor carried a 26, just a 27. I guess I also didn't take into consideration that I am about 20 lbs heavier now than I was when I had my 27, so carrying it now may be more comfortable. Seeing as I EDC a G19, I could see a 26 or 27 being better for carrying now than before. The man asked for OPINIONS, that's all I gave, was my personal opinion on the subject. Sorry if anyone got butthurt.
Sorry, but you're confusing me a little as well. I'll start by saying I've been shooting handguns for almost 50 years. I'm 67 and am 6' 220lbs., which is slightly bigger than others in this discussion.

First of all let me say your ammo cost and availability statement is totally wrong. I've bought plenty of .40 ammo and never had any trouble with availability. My last box at Walmart was $18. Certainly not a budget breaker. I have had a little problem with 9's, but no big deal. As far as price I've found the .40's to be either the same and sometimes even cheaper where the fmj ammo is concerned. So price and availability is of no concern in reality. Manageability I guess is an individual thing, but when shooting an anything .40 caliber man stopper what do you expect? Heck you can punch paper with .22's, so why go bigger. The .40 is a .40 and a .44 and .45 are what they are. I know women who have no complaints and many depts near me are in fact changing over to the .40 from the 9mm and that'll be used by both men and women. I guess you have to live with whatever you can handle and it's your business.

Now, the Kel-Tec PF-9 that you preferred over the Glock really stumps me. How much experience with firearms do you actually have? Being retired LE I can't understand how anyone would choose that Kel-Tec over any Glock regardless of caliber. Dependability is priority number one where SD is concerned. You'd be hard pressed to find any dept in the country that would authorize that weapon for service use, or anyone wanting to chose that for a service weapon. Their reputation for dependability is less than desirable. Play with them at a range, but don't bet your life on one. By the way, how did you like shooting it? Since it's way lighter at a hair under 15 oz. loaded, which is a big difference form the G26, how was that recoil with 9mm ammo. I'd expect it'd have, like those describing the .40S&W, a bit of a snap.

Since you put on 20lbs. you're considering a G26. Maybe it would be a good idea if you found one to try out first, cause in the hand it may feel like a brick. But you wouldn't be alone. The biggest complaint I hear about Glocks is that they feel uncomfortable. If someone feels that way after picking one up then I'd recommend they don't buy it, just like if they didn't like the .40. But at least buy something instead that's considered quality like a Sig, just as an example.

No one should get offended because someone doesn't like a particular gun, or a particular caliber and most don't. Just don't confuse offense with someone who can dispute the reasons for a particular dislike. After all, it's the right of the person who will be a carrying a particular gun to have his, or her own point of view, whether right, or wrong.
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Old 03-21-2014, 04:54 AM   #22
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Good post again Gunsmoke, and informative. 67? Ya got me beat by 1 year! We often hear how easy it is to handle 9mm and get off a quick follow up shot over 40S&W but truthfully, when you're talking hot self defense loads, both calibers are going to be snappy. And if you're practicing with standard loads neither recoil that hard, though 9mm less.

The G26/27 aren't ideal handguns, but are a good compromise when concealed carry is in the equation. If you can comfortably conceal the G19/23 of course they should be considered since most people find them easier to handle and fire. And they hold 4-5 more rounds.

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Old 03-21-2014, 05:00 AM   #23
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Quentin, It's depressing when it seems like everyone's younger than me.

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Old 03-21-2014, 06:53 AM   #24
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Good post again Gunsmoke, and informative. 67? Ya got me beat by 1 year! We often hear how easy it is to handle 9mm and get off a quick follow up shot over 40S&W but truthfully, when you're talking hot self defense loads, both calibers are going to be snappy. And if you're practicing with standard loads neither recoil that hard, though 9mm less.

The G26/27 aren't ideal handguns, but are a good compromise when concealed carry is in the equation. If you can comfortably conceal the G19/23 of course they should be considered since most people find them easier to handle and fire. And they hold 4-5 more rounds.
Just wanted to add that you're right and the Glock isn't the ultimate handgun. As a matter of fact it took me years to even consider getting one. I always loved my Colt DS and Smith revolvers. My T-Series Browning HP is still sitting on it's pedestal, cause it's a thing of beauty with it's French walnut grips and beautiful blued steel that's as dependable as a fine Swiss watch. Not to mention it's 13+1 ammo capacity that was unheard of in the good old days. At times I still carry it.

I carried mostly over the years after I retired my Sig228 that I got when they first came out. It was my first gun with an alloy frame and damn it it's magnificent. I still carry my old snub nose DS at times and am probably most comfortable with it. It's funny when I had to only carry a .38 revolver I complained about it like everyone else did. So now here I am in love with my old girlfriend again. Go figure.

The Glock with the plastic(polymer) always turned me off, but when I shot my son's G26 there was just something about it that whispered I'll always work for you if you need me. It was kinda like a Rod Serling Twilight Zone episode. It wasn't very pretty and I have many others that feel better when shooting, but I wanted a larger calibre than my other 9's and I knew it would work like the Eveready bunny, which it does. I will say that if you lighten it's standard 5.5 lb. trigger like many suggest, you stand a good chance of blowing your testies off. Owning a Glock requires common sense. The G27 isn't the best, but for SD it's up there with the best of them. You're never too old to learn. This must be one of those nights that I babble on like a woman. Sorry if I bored anyone.
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Old 03-21-2014, 06:59 AM   #25
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Just wanted to add that you're right and the Glock isn't the ultimate handgun. As a matter of fact it took me years to even consider getting one. I always loved my Colt DS and Smith revolvers. My T-Series Browning HP is still sitting on it's pedestal, cause it's a thing of beauty with it's French walnut grips and beautiful blued steel that's as dependable as a fine Swiss watch. Not to mention it's 13+1 ammo capacity that was unheard of in the good old days. At times I still carry it.

I carried mostly over the years after I retired my Sig228 that I got when they first came out. It was my first gun with an alloy frame and damn it it's magnificent. I still carry my old snub nose DS at times and am probably most comfortable with it. It's funny when I had to only carry a .38 revolver I complained about it like everyone else did. So now here I am in love with my old girlfriend again. Go figure.

The Glock with the plastic(polymer) always turned me off, but when I shot my son's G26 there was just something about it that whispered I'll always work for you if you need me. It was kinda like a Rod Serling Twilight Zone episode. It wasn't very pretty and I have many others that feel better when shooting, but I wanted a larger calibre than my other 9's and I knew it would work like the Eveready bunny, which it does. I will say that if you lighten it's standard 5.5 lb. trigger like many suggest, you stand a good chance of blowing your testies off. Owning a Glock requires common sense. The G27 isn't the best, but for SD it's up there with the best of them. You're never too old to learn. This must be one of those nights that I babble on like a woman. Sorry if I bored anyone.
babble on! very well said Gunsmoke.

i think many of us who are a bit older and came along before when all pistols were steel or alloy, have a harder time falling in love with a polymer pistol.

i have come to understand them, will even own them, but they will never have the same affection from me that i have for the steel and alloy pistols i own.
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Old 03-21-2014, 07:03 PM   #26
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Just wanted to add that you're right and the Glock isn't the ultimate handgun. As a matter of fact it took me years to even consider getting one. I always loved my Colt DS and Smith revolvers. My T-Series Browning HP is still sitting on it's pedestal, cause it's a thing of beauty with it's French walnut grips and beautiful blued steel that's as dependable as a fine Swiss watch. Not to mention it's 13+1 ammo capacity that was unheard of in the good old days. At times I still carry it.

I carried mostly over the years after I retired my Sig228 that I got when they first came out. It was my first gun with an alloy frame and damn it it's magnificent. I still carry my old snub nose DS at times and am probably most comfortable with it. It's funny when I had to only carry a .38 revolver I complained about it like everyone else did. So now here I am in love with my old girlfriend again. Go figure.

The Glock with the plastic(polymer) always turned me off, but when I shot my son's G26 there was just something about it that whispered I'll always work for you if you need me. It was kinda like a Rod Serling Twilight Zone episode. It wasn't very pretty and I have many others that feel better when shooting, but I wanted a larger calibre than my other 9's and I knew it would work like the Eveready bunny, which it does. I will say that if you lighten it's standard 5.5 lb. trigger like many suggest, you stand a good chance of blowing your testies off. Owning a Glock requires common sense. The G27 isn't the best, but for SD it's up there with the best of them. You're never too old to learn. This must be one of those nights that I babble on like a woman. Sorry if I bored anyone.
I, too, still sometimes carry my Browning T-Series. Love that gun!

I started using Glocks in the late 80's when I needed a .40 caliber as a minimum for a league in which I was shooting. Naturally I wanted the "baby" Glock to go with my G22 so I bought the G27 and used it quite a bit and never thought much about the recoil or cost shooting the .40 vs. the 9mm. I reloaded for the .40 so that helped the cost quite a bit. Later, I converted over to 9's after the league went defunct and shot G17's, G34's &, of course I had to have the "baby" 9 for carry, so I got my G26. I would have kept that gun except it shot so far to the left I couldn't adjust the rear sight to compensate, so it went down the road. I also got rid of my .40's because I just didn't shoot them anymore. I still liked them and still looked for ammo when I was buying 9's but the ammo availability must have been regional because it was spotty around here and then the supply would ebb and flow.

The only difference that would make me pause to consider which to buy, as ammo availability is fine now and price isn't that much different, is the felt recoil. Neither gun's recoil is that bad, but the G27 is a bit snappier and I like the recoil impulse of the G26, but then, I'm more used to 9's. If gungun92 follows the advice of some of the wise posters here and ends up wanting the G27 - go ahead and buy one. The worst that can happen is you won't like it and want a G26 or some other gun. Finding the perfect carry gun is a work in progress. Some will find the perfect one straight away while others will continue looking for years. I have three carry guns I use on a regular basis, but I'll have to admit, the new G42 looks awfully nice...
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Old 03-23-2014, 06:00 PM   #27
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I am 5' 10" and 150 and have not had any problem with shooting 27.

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Old 03-25-2014, 03:23 AM   #28
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Sorry, but you're confusing me a little as well. I'll start by saying I've been shooting handguns for almost 50 years. I'm 67 and am 6' 220lbs., which is slightly bigger than others in this discussion.


Now, the Kel-Tec PF-9 that you preferred over the Glock really stumps me. How much experience with firearms do you actually have? Being retired LE I can't understand how anyone would choose that Kel-Tec over any Glock regardless of caliber. Dependability is priority number one where SD is concerned. You'd be hard pressed to find any dept in the country that would authorize that weapon for service use, or anyone wanting to chose that for a service weapon. Their reputation for dependability is less than desirable. Play with them at a range, but don't bet your life on one. By the way, how did you like shooting it? Since it's way lighter at a hair under 15 oz. loaded, which is a big difference form the G26, how was that recoil with 9mm ammo. I'd expect it'd have, like those describing the .40S&W, a bit of a snap.
Have you ever pulled the slide off a Kel Tec P11? The Kel Tec is made a lot like a G19. Both have the same lame ass ejector. The Kel Tec has a superior rail system. They both can be fitted with a variety of trigger springs. At least the Kel Tec has a Mec Gar metal magazine. Believe me I know. I have owned both pistols.

The glock is more accurate. But the Kel Tec will do at 10 yards. Plus the Kel Tec is an 11 shot pistol you can pocket carry on the beach. Once you figure out the Kel Tec it will shoot 1.000s of rounds without a malfunction, it will even run with a broken ejector. The Kel Tec is not a duty pistol but for a mouse pistol it is very hard to beat.
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Old 03-25-2014, 05:48 AM   #29
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Just wanted to add that you're right and the Glock isn't the ultimate handgun. As a matter of fact it took me years to even consider getting one. I always loved my Colt DS and Smith revolvers. My T-Series Browning HP is still sitting on it's pedestal, cause it's a thing of beauty with it's French walnut grips and beautiful blued steel that's as dependable as a fine Swiss watch. Not to mention it's 13+1 ammo capacity that was unheard of in the good old days. At times I still carry it.

I carried mostly over the years after I retired my Sig228 that I got when they first came out. It was my first gun with an alloy frame and damn it it's magnificent. I still carry my old snub nose DS at times and am probably most comfortable with it. It's funny when I had to only carry a .38 revolver I complained about it like everyone else did. So now here I am in love with my old girlfriend again. Go figure.

The Glock with the plastic(polymer) always turned me off, but when I shot my son's G26 there was just something about it that whispered I'll always work for you if you need me. It was kinda like a Rod Serling Twilight Zone episode. It wasn't very pretty and I have many others that feel better when shooting, but I wanted a larger calibre than my other 9's and I knew it would work like the Eveready bunny, which it does. I will say that if you lighten it's standard 5.5 lb. trigger like many suggest, you stand a good chance of blowing your testies off. Owning a Glock requires common sense. The G27 isn't the best, but for SD it's up there with the best of them. You're never too old to learn. This must be one of those nights that I babble on like a woman. Sorry if I bored anyone.
Gunsmoke, I also grew up with the classic handguns so was slow to warm up to polymer as you and Axxe said. As a young man I loved my S&W Model 19 and Colt Government Model. I also was a Hi Power fan but didn't buy one till much later. I carried the Colt 45ACP for 36 years as it was an excellent pistol in 1976 when I got it and still is today.

But I caught a sale on LE trade-in Glock 22s a few years back and picked out a nice one. I'd been wanting to try out a Glock and 40S&W so couldn't resist. I loved it from day one and was impressed with the caliber. Once I was certain of its reliability the Colt was retired to the safe, I couldn't ignore twice the capacity at a lighter weight. Later I bought a new 23Gen4 and soon after found a good deal on a used G27. No matter how much I love the classics I see the advantages of the new designs. Old dogs can learn new tricks!

I went through a similar but much accelerated evolution with the AR-15. I hadn't handled the platform since 'Nam 1968 when I decided to get a retro AR in 2008. As I researched over many months my design morphed into a current day M4, then finally a midlength gas model. It just made sense to incorporate the improvements over 40+ years! As a concession, I did build an ArmaLite, after all AR stands for ArmaLite!
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Old 03-25-2014, 02:44 PM   #30
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Have you ever pulled the slide off a Kel Tec P11? The Kel Tec is made a lot like a G19. Both have the same lame ass ejector. The Kel Tec has a superior rail system. They both can be fitted with a variety of trigger springs. At least the Kel Tec has a Mec Gar metal magazine. Believe me I know. I have owned both pistols.

The glock is more accurate. But the Kel Tec will do at 10 yards. Plus the Kel Tec is an 11 shot pistol you can pocket carry on the beach. Once you figure out the Kel Tec it will shoot 1.000s of rounds without a malfunction, it will even run with a broken ejector. The Kel Tec is not a duty pistol but for a mouse pistol it is very hard to beat.
Sorry, I'm not a gunsmith, but I think I can recognize an inferior weapon when handling one and I have shot just a couple of Kel-Tecs and examined them closely even in gunshops. Two individuals that I tried to talk out of buying the Kel-Tec and was unsuccessful in doing so dumped both of them. Maybe you can locate a couple of small ones, but I know of no major PD that would even authorize a Kel-Tec for off duty carry, or as a backup. They do have their reasons and since their depts usually don't pay for them I'm sure cost has nothing to do with it, but their quality does concern them a lot. Seeing a Kel-Tec fire 1000's of rounds without a malfunction is something I'd have to see in order to believe it. What other reason would they have for not using them if dependability wasn't in question?

Since you mentioned pocket carry on the beach, my ex-partner was one of those who didn't listen to me when I recommended he get the NAA Guardian that I've pocket carried when I had to dependably for over 10 years. Unlike the Kel-Tec it has a nice trigger and is all stainless steel with a metal mag that you seem to prefer. My friend's Kel-Tec was cheaper and lighter, but had the lousiest trigger I could think of and jammed several times. My NAA never ftf, not ever.

As far as mag capacity is concerned the Glock will accept other higher capacity mags as long as the calibre is the same. I cant carry a Glock 27 in my pocket cause my jeans aren't loose fitting, but a 22 rd .40 mag works great in a shoulder rig. They even have drums available.

I can only conclude by saying that the Glock has earned an excellent track record that is recognized world wide by millions and really can't be disputed. Their polymer mags have never caused me, or anyone I know any problems, ever. People who know the Glock know to use only Glock mfg mags. I find it very difficult to place the Kel-Tec anywhere near the same class as the G19. I find nothing superior to the Glock where Kel-Tec is concerned. Obviously there is a market for cheaper guns and I guess seeing their popularity Kel-Tec fills the bill. I for one would never own one, but that's just my opinion and we're all entitled to one whether right, or wrong.

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