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-   -   When to draw w/o brandishing or deadly conduct? (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f55/when-draw-w-o-brandishing-deadly-conduct-40319/)

Poink88 03-26-2011 12:49 PM

When to draw w/o brandishing or deadly conduct?
 
My wife asked me a hypothetical question. We are in TX and here is the scenario...

She had a flat tire and had to pull over in a secluded area. A stranger stops and offers help and she politely declines and requests the stranger to stay away (repeatedly). Stranger continues to approach and she is starting to get worried and scared. Short of running back inside the car...when can she draw and not be charged of brandishing or deadly conduct (if the stranger reports her after)?

Should she call in a 911 report to the police shortly after?

Any other things you can suggest in this scenario will be much appreciated.

Jo da Plumbr 03-26-2011 12:59 PM

I'm not a law enforcement officer but I've been beaten by a few...

The rule of thumb I have heard is the 7 yard mark is where a person can get to you before you can draw. So if I was truly afraid for my safety, and had warned the approaching stranger to leave in a clear and concise manner, When they got to seven yards I would be drawing and aiming in self defense. Then if they left with no shoots fired I would be calling the police to report and give the police the license number.

Car54 03-26-2011 01:36 PM

First off, Throughout the years it's been stressed over and over that if you break down on the road for whatever reason, tie something white to an antennae, or hang something out a window and you stay in the car with the windows up and the doors locked. If you have a cell phone call a family member, if you have AAA or similar road service call the 800 number, or call the police. If someone approaches with an offer to help you at the most, you bring the window down just enough so you can be heard clearly. If help is on the way you can ask the potential helper you wouldn't mind someone staying nearby but please return to your car and wait. If you don't have a cell you can ask the helper to call the police and you'll wait until they arrive to contact family or road service.

If caught outside of the vehicle as an approaching stranger pulls over and stops, she should have been getting into her car as the stranger pulled up, locking the doors and closing the windows. By waiting, she put herself in potential harms way and if the scenario played out to the point of a weapon drawn, this would be the first question as to why didn't she seek the safety of her car.

If it goes this far to the point the stranger keeps approaching, she should announce loudly and at the same time getting a firm grip on the weapon and tell the stranger, I am armed, you are scaring me please go back to your car. If the stranger keeps approaching, draw the weapon and order the stranger to stop and return to the car.

And yes if that happened, you better be on the phone with 911 immediately when it's safe to do so.

Poink88 03-26-2011 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Car54 (Post 473043)
First off, Throughout the years it's been stressed over and over that if you break down on the road for whatever reason, tie something white to an antennae, or hang something out a window and you stay in the car with the windows up and the doors locked. If you have a cell phone call a family member, if you have AAA or similar road service call the 800 number, or call the police. If someone approaches with an offer to help you at the most, you bring the window down just enough so you can be heard clearly. If help is on the way you can ask the potential helper you wouldn't mind someone staying nearby but please return to your car and wait. If you don't have a cell you can ask the helper to call the police and you'll wait until they arrive to contact family or road service.

If caught outside of the vehicle as an approaching stranger pulls over and stops, she should have been getting into her car as the stranger pulled up, locking the doors and closing the windows. By waiting, she put herself in potential harms way and if the scenario played out to the point of a weapon drawn, this would be the first question as to why didn't she seek the safety of her car.

If it goes this far to the point the stranger keeps approaching, she should announce loudly and at the same time getting a firm grip on the weapon and tell the stranger, I am armed, you are scaring me please go back to your car. If the stranger keeps approaching, draw the weapon and order the stranger to stop and return to the car.

And yes if that happened, you better be on the phone with 911 immediately when it's safe to do so.

Thanks!

We understand about being inside as much as possible but this is something she can remedy or try to fix. The scenario is also geared towards a more general "application" with the bottom line question of "when can/should I really draw."

We know a lot of CCL holders and amazingly, very few really know how to answer this question since (possible) threat is not clearly defined and maybe never until it is too late.

hogrider 03-26-2011 02:50 PM

Have we come so far down that a good Samaritan cant' help a lady? Being a motorcycle rider, I welcome the help if I'm on the side of the road but only from another motorcycle rider. So I understand the question and concern about someone in a vehicle and someone approaching. I think something on the antenna is a good idea but doesn't that say you are looking for assistance? Maybe if this wasn't a secluded area the question wouldn't have come up. But I keep going back to, what would I do on a motorcycle or what would I do if I saw a lady at the side of the road. My first take is that I would want to help. Guess I'll think twice living in Texas. Never dawned on me the someone would not want assistance.

Poink88 03-26-2011 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by larry5081 (Post 473084)
Have we come so far down that a good Samaritan cant' help a lady? Being a motorcycle rider, I welcome the help if I'm on the side of the road but only from another motorcycle rider. So I understand the question and concern about someone in a vehicle and someone approaching. I think something on the antenna is a good idea but doesn't that say you are looking for assistance? Maybe if this wasn't a secluded area the question wouldn't have come up. But I keep going back to, what would I do on a motorcycle or what would I do if I saw a lady at the side of the road. My first take is that I would want to help. Guess I think twice living in Texas. Never dawned on me the someone would not want assistance.

Assistance is welcome but if you declined and the person persists, that is another story. (due to various factors)

Scenario is just to drive a point and believe me, we are very friendly here. Sorry if the example created that false picture of Texas.

Mentioning Texas was just meant to address different local laws.

Rick1967 03-26-2011 02:58 PM

Hey Larry. I hear you. I would never drive by a lady by herself on the side of the road. If there is already a man there, I might not stop. But I am old school. A gentleman never leaves a lady in distress.

That said...If she said she didn't need help, I would leave her alone.

Car54 03-26-2011 03:12 PM

Larry, you are absolutely correct. Anyone in a position to aid someone should do it, but when asked to leave or told No I don't need help, it's time to wish them good luck and leave.

Several times I have been driving somewhere and I've seen people on the side of the road, and either I'm not in a position to stop or I have somewhere or something important to attend to. Those times I always call either 911 or some states have a three number assistance line. Here in Fla it's *347 for the Highway Patrol.

What's interesting though is now the dispatcher tries to get as much info from the caller attempting to verify the actual need or is it a prank call, or an set up/ambush type thing.

Poink88 03-28-2011 01:28 PM

Thanks guys!

JonM 03-28-2011 03:15 PM

i help stuck folks a lot. usually i roll the window down enough to see if they need aid and assess if they are truly in distress or not. my usual offer is to call someone for them if they have not done so.

the sad thing is in today's age and most other times there are enough goblins that prey on the helpless to make it a risk. but i stop to help or call the police if i cant. as in opposite side of traffic in a divided highway.

my instruction to my wife is she should call me stay in the truck till i get there or call the police or onstar if she is stranded way out. but stay inside the vehicle and dont roll the window down more than a crack to talk to strangers.


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