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 12-03-2010, 03:40 AM | #21 | Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 443 |  locks
That was good. I have experimented with penetration before. I had a penetration board made up to show the Hunter Safety class what would happen IF?
Many say, heck all say that the little .25acp is a mouse gun and not capible of protecting you. Statistics show that the .25acp and the .22 LR are the most common guns used in killings. (recently the 9mmL has taken over to be the most common) I made up a box with pine boards each 1" from the other and 12 boards in all. The .22 LR went through the 8th and dented the 9th. The .25acp went through 4 boards and lodged in the 5th one. Now I know I am not as tough as 4 inches of pine. How about you?
Sarge | 
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| 12-29-2010, 06:41 PM | #22 | Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Mountains, Georgia Posts: 53 |
+1 for behind the engine.As long as you can keep your feet from getting shot... __________________
Springfield Armory 1911 TRP,two of them,in Simply Rugged holsters for the summer and Andrews double shoulder holster for winter.
Benelli MR1 AR-15 with Surefire light/laser.
Benelli M2 with Surefire light. | |
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| 12-30-2010, 01:26 PM | #23 | Supporting Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 641 |
There are as many answers to this question as there are scenarios. Car or wall? That's just one of a thousand variables. Cars have steel in them. Walls are mortar. But what about the corner of a building where two walls meet? How many guns are shooting at you? What kind of penetration do their rounds have? How skilled are the shooters? How far away are they? What other options do you have? You can train for as many possibilities as you want and you are still likely to encounter one you haven't trained for...or a variation of it.
What if you have no cover at all? Or no where to run? The quickest way to get out of an open kill zone in a close ambush is to engage the source and assault through it. It greatly lessens the time you are under fire and it surprises your attacker. | |
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| 12-30-2010, 01:49 PM | #24 | When it's Necessary.... Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tornado "Just Blow Me" Alley, Oklahoma U.S.A. Posts: 8,424 |
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7point62
What if you have no cover at all? Or no where to run? The quickest way to get out of an open kill zone in a close ambush is to engage the source and assault through it. It greatly lessens the time you are under fire and it surprises your attacker.
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"QFT!"  __________________
Jack
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ!
"There is no hunting like the hunting of man, and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never care for anything else thereafter." - Hemingway
“The greatest ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about.” | |
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| 12-30-2010, 09:08 PM | #25 | Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 443 | places to hide
Let me throw some more in here. First of all in the Army and in war, you will be facing multiple enemy and usually on their ground. Also you may not be able to count on the calvery to come galloping into the scene in time. In this case I agree with the Marine. Attack, clear a excape route.
But now lets put us in a civilian police officers position. All he has to do is stay alive until his back up roars up. Which usually takes less than 5 min. max. Also in civilian police work the possibility of having multiple aggressors is very low. At the most you would have to contend with only as many as can be stuffed in one car. And the chance or them hanging around after they unleash a barrage of noisy gun fire is in the lower percentile. If they think they got you or they do not get any return fire they will hightail it out of the the area MOUX SNELL. (Very Quickly) Now how about the homeowner that just had a burgalar show up unexpected. He is likely to throw a few shots in your way to slow you down or make you duck so he can get away. So long sustained fire fights are so rare as hen's teeth. One should think first of cover and then of accurate return fire. Usually the first close bullet to a perp's head will cause him to remember somewhere he wanted to be.
Sarge __________________
If a man strikes you on the cheek
Being a Christian the only thing you can do
Is to help him up off the ground.
Sarge | |
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| 12-30-2010, 09:54 PM | #26 | Deader Bears=Better Bears Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: BFE, Mississippi Posts: 10,078 Likes Given: 3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skullcrusher
Wait, you did not train the ones who were in the LA shootout a few years back, did you?  |
The bank robbery gone bad? IIRC, they started putting bullet resistant vest panels in the doors of the squad cars & issued some AR's. __________________
Dead Bears, the only good kind.
DEATH TO FREE-RANGING BEARS!!! (except FTF members ;) ) | |
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| 12-31-2010, 02:17 AM | #27 | Supporting Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 641 |
Quote:
Originally Posted by IGETEVEN
"QFT!"
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I knew a Ranger/SF would get React to Near Ambush...That was even before I looked at your profile.  Battle Drill #3 in your book. I forget what it is in ours. | |
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| 12-31-2010, 08:13 PM | #28 | Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: south of louisville, Kentucky Posts: 508 |
If you find your self in a parking lot or something and someone opens fire, mugger, crazy person, angry ex... etc. One of the most obvious places to hide is behind a car but you really only can use part of the car as a cover from bullets. The 45 ACP will go through both sides of a car door, from test they've even gone through both side of the car. So if your sneaking around ya the car will cover you. The best chance is to put you body behind the engine block. __________________
"ever man out here has a timer, no one know how long it will take but no one last forever"
Sargent Miller
"cake or death! I'll have the cake then... SORRY WHERE OUT OF CAKE!... so it's or death? I'll have the chicken then please." Eddy Izzard
"so a suppose your going to kill me now? no he is I'm just here to watch"
"you know why guns are better then a woman?... you can put a silencer on a gun." | |
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| 01-01-2011, 03:18 PM | #29 | Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Boone, NC, North Carolina Posts: 123 |
you may want to check out this site as it has a wealth of interesting penetration--"boxof truth
The Box O' Truth - The Box O' Truth__________________
montveil
in the NC mountains | |
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| 01-01-2011, 03:29 PM | #30 | Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 443 | Box of Truth
Quote:
Originally Posted by montveil
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Yepp I regularly read their entres. Most of my posts are from my own personaly experience. Some are from training at Police Academies. Others are from articles I read that are from genuine real people not armchair commandos.
Sarge __________________
If a man strikes you on the cheek
Being a Christian the only thing you can do
Is to help him up off the ground.
Sarge | |
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