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Old 01-26-2014, 07:51 PM   #41
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I always refer to accuracy as placing a balloon over my predetermined area. If the shot would pop the balloon it is accurate. If it would not then it is not accurate.

The level of precision required is what changes.

In defensive the balloon would be the entire high center chest (most of the time) and require less precision. In Target shooting it would be the bulleseye or whatever ring represents that students level of precision.

Once the student is able to "pop the balloon" each time we can make our predetermined area smaller and fine tune to get more precise.



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Old 01-26-2014, 08:03 PM   #42
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I keep thinking about this thread, and there is something that is really bugging me. What we are calling accuracy is not accuracy at all. What we are talking about is skill, talent, consistency, or ability. Accuracy is determined by the firearm, and only the firearm. It is the ability of the firearm to deliver shots on target under controlled conditions. Add a human to the mix and the controlled conditions cease to exist.

If you clamp down the firearm and fire 10 rounds through the same hole at 25 yards, that is accuracy. Anything else is determined by your acceptance level. If that same clamped down firearm delivers one inch groups at 25 yards that is an acceptable level of... are you ready for this?... inaccuracy. Yes, it's a heck of a lot better than most people can do freehand with that same firearm, but it's still inaccurate.



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Old 01-27-2014, 01:38 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc3402 View Post
I keep thinking about this thread, and there is something that is really bugging me. What we are calling accuracy is not accuracy at all. What we are talking about is skill, talent, consistency, or ability. Accuracy is determined by the firearm, and only the firearm. It is the ability of the firearm to deliver shots on target under controlled conditions. Add a human to the mix and the controlled conditions cease to exist.

If you clamp down the firearm and fire 10 rounds through the same hole at 25 yards, that is accuracy. Anything else is determined by your acceptance level. If that same clamped down firearm delivers one inch groups at 25 yards that is an acceptable level of... are you ready for this?... inaccuracy. Yes, it's a heck of a lot better than most people can do freehand with that same firearm, but it's still inaccurate.
Correct you are. But there are terms in the business for what you discussed above.
1. 'Inherent' accuracy- This is the accuracy of the weapon only when fired from a machine rest or other solid rest.
2. 'Practical' accuracy- This the accuracy achieved by the shooter, with the ability's you discussed above.
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Old 01-27-2014, 03:13 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRau View Post
Correct you are. But there are terms in the business for what you discussed above.
1. 'Inherent' accuracy- This is the accuracy of the weapon only when fired from a machine rest or other solid rest.
2. 'Practical' accuracy- This the accuracy achieved by the shooter, with the ability's you discussed above.
Somewhere, in the middle of all this, however, is the average guy shooting

what he shoots, accurate or inaccurate, to his standard, and deciding for

himself what is good, and not so satisfactory. For some, the 9 ring at

100 yards drops the deer. For some, MOA isn't good enough.

IMHO, accuracy is more the perception of accuracy, by ourselves, and others.

Case in point: I already know a rifle from a rest is accurate. By itself, it means

nothing to me. But if I can fire that same rifle, from a standing position, and hit

a target at 100 yards, that accuracy has meaning for me.
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Old 01-27-2014, 03:31 AM   #45
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It all depends on your shooting sport. The "Bench Rest" shooter chases the Holy Grail of 5 shots in one hole at 100 yds. The Combat hand gunner hopes for center mass and races a clock. The Cowboy Shooter shoots a lot and just hopes. The kid in all of us just loves to roll beer cans with a .22.

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Old 01-27-2014, 04:23 PM   #46
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It all depends on your shooting sport. The "Bench Rest" shooter chases the Holy Grail of 5 shots in one hole at 100 yds. The Combat hand gunner hopes for center mass and races a clock. The Cowboy Shooter shoots a lot and just hopes. The kid in all of us just loves to roll beer cans with a .22.
What he said, it is all 'relative' to the circumstances and individual!
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Old 01-27-2014, 05:15 PM   #47
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Its the ability to practice consistanly enough with a certain weapon to become a master!

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Old 01-27-2014, 07:21 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRau View Post
Correct you are. But there are terms in the business for what you discussed above.
1. 'Inherent' accuracy- This is the accuracy of the weapon only when fired from a machine rest or other solid rest.
2. 'Practical' accuracy- This the accuracy achieved by the shooter, with the ability's you discussed above.
I understand, and that's where my problem lies. By adding a modifier to the term 'accuracy' we are misusing the word. I think that's why the title of the video bothered me from the beginning. It's not that some shooters choose to accept certain levels of performance. It's the fact that this yahoo is saying that you can call hits all over the 9 ring an acceptable level of accuracy.
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Old 01-28-2014, 12:54 AM   #49
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Accuracy is relevant to the varied use of firearms. A shotgun that can break 25 clay pigeons at 27 yds is accurate. Obviously that shot gun would not be considered accurate to a Long range varmint shooter. A 30-30 carbine that is used at 30 yds. to kill deer is accurate to the hunter. The Western Antelope hunter would not consider a 30-30 carbine an accurate hunting rifle.
Each persuite where firearms are used has it's own criteria for accuracy. Simply hitting a 10 ring may be satisfying to the novice. Keeping 5 in the ten ring off hand at 100 yds. is an entry level competition shooter.

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Old 01-28-2014, 06:58 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nitestalker View Post
Accuracy is relevant to the varied use of firearms. A shotgun that can break 25 clay pigeons at 27 yds is accurate. Obviously that shot gun would not be considered accurate to a Long range varmint shooter. A 30-30 carbine that is used at 30 yds. to kill deer is accurate to the hunter. The Western Antelope hunter would not consider a 30-30 carbine an accurate hunting rifle.
Each persuite where firearms are used has it's own criteria for accuracy. Simply hitting a 10 ring may be satisfying to the novice. Keeping 5 in the ten ring off hand at 100 yds. is an entry level competition shooter.
That's where we disagree. Accuracy doesn't have a darned thing to do with the use of firearms. What you're calling accuracy is actually skill. Accuracy is inherent (or not) in the firearm, not the shooter.


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