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Old 10-14-2013, 11:46 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by Axxe55

well that jusdge onle sentenced them to death, he didn't actually do the killing. huge difference. just because it's the moral thing to do, does not change the fact that it will change you.

i saw how killing another person changed a friend of mine. i saw personally the damage it did to him and his family. he was young LEO and had only been with the police department a few years when he killed a man coming at him with a knife and wouldn't drop it after being told to many times, "Jimmy" shot the many twice in the chest and the man died a short time later. "Jimmy" was never the same easy going and good natured person he was before that night. that shooting was a righteous and justified shooting, but it was in some ways very hard to convince him it was. he was never the same person i use to know and joke around with, after that night.

i have to agree with DeltaF, that only a sociopath can kill and not have any emotions about it.
It def. takes away the "desire" to do it again, Ever...
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Old 10-14-2013, 11:47 PM   #92
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Axxe55-
We're mixing two separate issues here : Issue #1 : The readiness to use deadly force if need be. Issue #2 : The emotonal toll one suffers after using justified deadly force that results in death .

FWIW : This subject of sociopaths is discussed extensively in On Killing by Col. David Grossman .
Book that Is "Required reading" for Warrant Officer Candidates....
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Old 10-14-2013, 11:50 PM   #93
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Axxe55 :
Nobody said Charles Whitman was a sociopath . They implied that I am a sociopath .

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Old 10-14-2013, 11:54 PM   #94
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Axxe55 :
Nobody said Charles Whitman was a sociopath . They implied that I am a sociopath .
sorry. my fault, i misread what you posted about Whitman.
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Old 10-15-2013, 12:28 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by Rentacop
Axxe55-
We're mixing two separate issues here : Issue #1 : The readiness to use deadly force if need be. Issue #2 : The emotonal toll one suffers after using justified deadly force that results in death .

FWIW : This subject of sociopaths is discussed extensively in On Killing by Col. David Grossman .
If it means anything, I get what you're saying. Lol.

I wonder sometimes, as I'm sure many people here who haven't faced it do, how I'd react in a self defense situation and if I'd be able to pull the trigger if I needed to. I of course like to believe I'd be able to but you never can tell until the situation arises. If it looked as though I would be killed or someone else was going to be killed, I don't see why I wouldn't act. I don't know what emotional toll it would take after the fact, but it couldn't be worse than dying or letting someone else die if I could have prevented it.

There are some things that are better left undiscovered.
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:03 PM   #96
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Default "Shoot" until...?

No one else seemed to notice this.

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Oct 4, 2013

Oregon State Police Thursday released a dramatic video showing...

Allen was dead, shot once in the chest.
I watched and listened to the video tape. By my count, there were at least eight (8) shots fired (maybe more, my ears aren't as sharp as once was). The late Mr. Allen fired some of those shots, but the officer presumably fired more than once, did he not?

According to the news release, the late Mr. Allen was shot ONCE.

There are two lessons herein:

1. A killing wound is not always an immediate incapacitation wound.

2. Shots fired that actually HIT the target serve the purpose better.

No, I'm not belittling the Trooper for inaccuracy (and that might be different were I driving down range at the time); just pointing out that a fusillade if shots is not automatically multiple hits.

I know not what course others may take, but I would rather fire two shots that land where I desire than to fire fifteen misses.
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:14 PM   #97
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No one else seemed to notice this.I watched and listened to the video tape. By my count, there were at least eight (8) shots fired (maybe more, my ears aren't as sharp as once was). The late Mr. Allen fired some of those shots, but the officer presumably fired more than once, did he not?

According to the news release, the late Mr. Allen was shot ONCE.

There are two lessons herein:

1. A killing wound is not always an immediate incapacitation wound.

2. Shots fired that actually HIT the target serve the purpose better.

No, I'm not belittling the Trooper for inaccuracy (and that might be different were I driving down range at the time); just pointing out that a fusillade if shots is not automatically multiple hits.

I know not what course others may take, but I would rather fire two shots that land where I desire than to fire fifteen misses.
the main objective in a SD shooting is to stop the threat. whatever that may require. nothing about killing anyone or wounding them. you are only trying to stop that threat from inflicting any or more damage to you or your loved ones.

in the course of a SD shooting, and even at very close range, with adrenaline and fear flowing, your heart going a million beats per minute, you palms are sweating like crazy, can you gaurantee you will make two accurate hits, instead of fifteen misses?
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:20 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by Axxe55
the main objective in a SD shooting is to stop the threat. whatever that may require. nothing about killing anyone or wounding them. you are only trying to stop that threat from inflicting any or more damage to you or your loved ones. in the course of a SD shooting, and even at very close range, with adrenaline and fear flowing, your heart going a million beats per minute, you palms are sweating like crazy, can you gaurantee you will make two accurate hits, instead of fifteen misses?
Good points. It's all fine and good to sit in your armchair and type on a laptop about accurate hits under stress.

It's radically different to be out in the real world with someone trying to kill you while you try to kill them. Accuracy tanks for everyone when their adrenaline spikes.
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:24 PM   #99
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Good points. It's all fine and good to sit in your armchair and type on a laptop about accurate hits under stress.

It's radically different to be out in the real world with someone trying to kill you while you try to kill them. Accuracy tanks for everyone when their adrenaline spikes.
i fully agree with that. the only exception i would see to this would be combat troops who are trained to overcome this and to use it to their advantage. highly unlikely the average person would react the same as a trained combat soldier.
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:27 PM   #100
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i fully agree with that. the only exception i would see to this would be combat troops who are trained to overcome this and to use it to their advantage. highly unlikely the average person would react the same as a trained combat soldier.
I think those who have killed before have an easier time of it. LEOs and Military use fairly similar desensitization tactics for deadly force training. They're nothing special. Lots of gory photos, using silhouettes instead of bullseyes, training with simunitions etc.
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Nobody on this thread licked anybody's bodypart.

Nobody said anything.....about Glocks until you posted about your bacon dog who needs dentures.

What did somebody forget to engage their safety and shoot the dogs front teeth out? Or are we blaming that on the Glock shooters?

"Gaston, the Doggy dentist's best friend."
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