Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > General Firearms Forums > Training & Safety > Know Thy Enemy

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-23-2011, 01:29 AM   #1
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
BigByrd47119's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 3,401
Liked 1101 Times on 676 Posts
Likes Given: 2387

Default Know Thy Enemy

Here is a great article which really dives into the minds of criminals that carry, and use, firearms on LEO's. I found it to be a truly interesting read and I hope you will too!

Beg pardon if it has been posted here before...

News from The Force Science Research Center

Quote:
Familiarity:
Several of the offenders began regularly to carry weapons when they were 9 to 12 years old, although the average age was 17 when they first started packing "most of the time." Gang members especially started young.

Nearly 40% of the offenders had some type of formal firearms training, primarily from the military. More than 80% "regularly practiced with handguns, averaging 23 practice sessions a year," the study reports, usually in informal settings like trash dumps, rural woods, back yards and "street corners in known drug-trafficking areas."

One spoke of being motivated to improve his gun skills by his belief that officers "go to the range two, three times a week [and] practice arms so they can hit anything."

In reality, victim officers in the study averaged just 14 hours of sidearm training and 2.5 qualifications per year. Only 6 of the 50 officers reported practicing regularly with handguns apart from what their department required, and that was mostly in competitive shooting. Overall, the offenders practiced more often than the officers they assaulted, and this "may have helped increase [their] marksmanship skills," the study says.

The offender quoted above about his practice motivation, for example, fired 12 rounds at an officer, striking him 3 times. The officer fired 7 rounds, all misses.

More than 40% of the offenders had been involved in actual shooting confrontations before they feloniously assaulted an officer. Ten of these "street combat veterans," all from "inner-city, drug-trafficking environments," had taken part in 5 or more "criminal firefight experiences" in their lifetime.

One reported that he was 14 when he was first shot on the street, "about 18 before a cop shot me." Another said getting shot was a pivotal experience "because I made up my mind no one was gonna shoot me again."

Again in contrast, only 8 of the 50 LEO victims had participated in a prior shooting; 1 had been involved in 2 previously, another in 3. Seven of the 8 had killed offenders.
News from The Force Science Research Center
__________________

“Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it’s realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy.”
---Ron Paul

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetuate it."
---Dr. Martin Luther King

"If you think we are free today, you know nothing about tyranny and even less about freedom."
---Tom Braun


Last edited by BigByrd47119; 09-23-2011 at 07:31 AM.
BigByrd47119 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote

Join FirearmsTalk.com Today - It's Free!

Are you a firearms enthusiast? Then we hope you will join the community. You will gain access to post, create threads, private message, upload images, join groups and more.

Firearms Talk is owned and operated by fellow firearms enthusiasts. We strive to offer a non-commercial community to learn and share information.

Join FirearmsTalk.com Today! - Click Here


Old 09-25-2011, 06:19 PM   #2
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
knfxda's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: FL
Posts: 692
Liked 19 Times on 14 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Wow! That was an eye-opening read. Should be required reading for all LEOs.

Sent from my iPhone using FirearmsTalk

__________________

"Ideology deludes, inspires dishonesty, and breeds fanaticism. Facts, experience, and logic are much better at leading you to the truth."

"Despite the conviction and seeming depth of knowledge with which ideologues speak, they are intellectual weaklings--joiners--who defer to systems of belief and charismatic gurus for their ideas." -- Daniel J. Flynn

GOA

knfxda is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2011, 06:28 PM   #3
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: West, by God, Funroe,Louisiana
Posts: 18,707
Liked 9185 Times on 5049 Posts
Likes Given: 74

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by knfxda View Post
Wow! That was an eye-opening read. Should be required reading for all LEOs.

Sent from my iPhone using FirearmsTalk
I think so too. Lets you know what your up against.
__________________
trip286 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2011, 10:51 PM   #4
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
BigByrd47119's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 3,401
Liked 1101 Times on 676 Posts
Likes Given: 2387

Default

Thats what got my attention. You always hear most of the things mentioned in the article, but I have never seen anyone attempt to actually quantify the points.

The difference in practice/training really opened my eyes!

__________________

“Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it’s realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy.”
---Ron Paul

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetuate it."
---Dr. Martin Luther King

"If you think we are free today, you know nothing about tyranny and even less about freedom."
---Tom Braun

BigByrd47119 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2011, 05:22 PM   #5
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Pasco Cty.FL
Posts: 6,202
Liked 2184 Times on 1253 Posts
Likes Given: 1777

Default

This article has me wondering :"Then why all the broo-hah about

'assault rifles' ?"

__________________
therewolf is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2011, 05:28 PM   #6
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
BenLuby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Douglasville,Georgia
Posts: 2,169
Liked 47 Times on 34 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by therewolf View Post
This article has me wondering :"Then why all the broo-hah about

'assault rifles' ?"
Because the easiest way to disarm a nation is to start with the 'big bad wolf', even if they have to make it up, and go from there.
Our government tends to approach liberty stomping with the eat an elephant policy. They usually do it a bit at a time, so that the drones in the nation never realize that they lost their rights.
__________________
BenLuby is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2011, 06:30 PM   #7
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
EagleSix's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Northeast,Arizona
Posts: 358
Liked 10 Times on 9 Posts
Likes Given: 32

Default

Most of the information in this article about the police I believe more than the information about the criminals. The police information is more verifiable from official police records (on the other hand I'm not sure the researching did this). The information from the criminal is primarily based on what a criminal is saying!

From my experience, the level of police training is pretty close to the article. However the level of training the criminal has I think is over stated.

Regardless, I think the article makes a point well worth the read.

__________________
Best Regards.......Eagle Six
http://tactrain.net
EagleSix is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 04:01 AM   #8
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
BigByrd47119's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 3,401
Liked 1101 Times on 676 Posts
Likes Given: 2387

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EagleSix View Post
Most of the information in this article about the police I believe more than the information about the criminals. The police information is more verifiable from official police records (on the other hand I'm not sure the researching did this). The information from the criminal is primarily based on what a criminal is saying!

From my experience, the level of police training is pretty close to the article. However the level of training the criminal has I think is over stated.

Regardless, I think the article makes a point well worth the read.
Valid points one and all.

I will say this though. We don't have any real way of learning more about the criminal element of the equation other than to simply ask. It makes us more or less reliant on what they are willing to tell us.

I have known many less than favorable characters when I was younger and a lot of what is said in the article seems to be in line with, or perhaps slightly overstated, from what I have known. On the other hand, even when I was younger, I never knew anyone that was bold enough to shoot at the LEO's...
__________________

“Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it’s realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy.”
---Ron Paul

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetuate it."
---Dr. Martin Luther King

"If you think we are free today, you know nothing about tyranny and even less about freedom."
---Tom Braun

BigByrd47119 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 02:03 PM   #9
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Pasco Cty.FL
Posts: 6,202
Liked 2184 Times on 1253 Posts
Likes Given: 1777

Default

Two things which has stayed with me for years.:

1)-It's been statistically proven that civilian gun owners

are generally more accurate than LEOs,

2)-In repeated interviews with criminals, they openly

admit they are more afraid of CCWs (us) than LEOs. We

don't follow police procedure, and we can show up anywhere

with pop one into them, with no Miranda, warning, or anything.

And the way the state laws are set up now, they feel we could

very possibly never even be charged.

__________________
therewolf is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 02:17 PM   #10
fmj
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
fmj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Fort Wayne,IN
Posts: 3,454
Liked 748 Times on 432 Posts
Likes Given: 306

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by therewolf View Post
Two things which has stayed with me for years.:

1)-It's been statistically proven that civilian gun owners

are generally more accurate than LEOs,

2)-In repeated interviews with criminals, they openly

admit they are more afraid of CCWs (us) than LEOs. We

don't follow police procedure, and we can show up anywhere

with pop one into them, with no Miranda, warning, or anything.

And the way the state laws are set up now, they feel we could

very possibly never even be charged.
quoted as FACT!

What i have never understood is why civies are more proficient than LEOs... imean c'mon. If i had ranges i could shoot for free, got paid to shoot, had paid for ammo etc. I would be pure hell on wheels, a crack shot extrodinare!!
__________________
"Those that would trade essential liberty for temporary security deserve neither liberty nor security." - Benjammin Franklin

The 1911: Turning useless trash into good fertilizer for over 100 years!!
fmj is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Firearms Forum Replies Last Post
A lesson from a former enemy. JTJ Politics, Religion and Controversy 8 02-16-2011 04:16 PM
The Enemy Within opaww The Club House 11 02-16-2010 12:58 PM
Terrorists: Have we fought such an enemy before? themanbeau The Club House 27 09-26-2009 04:53 AM
The Enemy Within npbwbass The Club House 8 06-13-2008 10:00 AM