Originally Posted by cbartrip6
Nice writeup Bluez. Would you say the class is geared toward those with LE or Military experience or could the average civilian feel comfortable without it being over their heads?
I am interested in getting tactical training but kinda don't know where to start as I have never been in Military or LE.
I was almost in the same boat as you.
While I am 23 years plus military but all except the first couple years involved very little tactical training.
So I know I have a deficit.
But I know/remember just enough to be an informed consumer
of tactical training and IMO to not fall into the faddish traps that many civilian 1st defenders fall when they sincerely want to get trained.
So I spent many months researching what class to attenbd.
My income is healthy so the extra expense of of popular big the such as EAG, magpul Dynamics and Viking Tactics did not scare me away by itself but watching their videos did.
Those raised a lot of red flags in my mind.
Their training seemed to be shaped by 3 things:
-They expect their attendees to be out of shape and refuse to challenge them.. thats why everyone is on nice flat grass fields , standing or a slow walk punching paper targets.
-Even tho many of the instructors are ex military their most recent work was in SWAT and as security contractors . Such outfits while very competent have a philosophy of Use, VERY different from what is useful for a civilian first responder. But its marketing tool for the customer " Oooo my instructor used to be SWAT or used to be SF"... dazzle...
- Integrating "cool tricks" to learn. How ever it is my conviction that the cool tricks of "Urban Prone" and "Transtion" etc etc are niche skills that apply fto very few situations and its better left to train once you mastered all the basics well. But it seems some school focus on them because they are easier to do than to run your students thru real lanes training.
Then I finally read about Max Velocity by accident on a forum somewhere.
(might have been this one.. not sure I am on a few)
About your primary question:
The vast majority of attendees are 100% civilians, all Max asks that anyone who attends knows how to run his gun. This is also in the interest of safety and since he does little to no actual "AR driving" training since it is his belief, (which I share) that we can do that on our own at a local square range and time is too valuable when you are out in tactics training.
Any "fighting rifle" is ok it does not have to be an AR.
We had some exmilitary , some retired cops, who of course, especially the ex military would have a bit of leg up but thats all it was.. a leg up.
people of dont realize how little tactical ability the avg LEO has and how little the avg non
Infantry, military man has..So we all learned...
The guy I observed and felt he was the best at small unit tactics had no such LEO or military at all (it wasnt his first time tho training I think)
here are some discussions you may be interested in that contrast the training philosphy of maxvelocity (and similar schools like mason dixon tactical in PA and Mosby's place in MI) to what currrently passes as mainstream.
He has a couple of harsh comments about forums in general but keep in mind he does NOT refer to this one...... but these 3 are IMO EXCELLENT essays on whats wrong with tactical training for civilians in our country and what some folks do to make it less fancy and more useful
The first link picks up on a review I wrote on another forum and he does a beautiful job of eloquently describing whats wrong with all the (in my mind wasteful) transition dancing the mainstream schools seem to insist on:
I know they are long
if you intend to get training please
read them as they a) explain a lot of important things and b) in a way that's rarely found in the mainstream training which in my mind borders on snake oil selling.
I am going back in a couple of weeks for a repeat.