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Old 03-16-2013, 09:31 PM   #31
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1911love-
Dragon Skin is military armor. So far, the military has rejected it in favor of their usual armor . There's a big stink about this on YouTube .
I'm not a LEO but what I've posted in this thread is based on wearing level II and level III .
Try wearing microfiber polyester undershirts, such as Underarmour Brand. Maybe keep talcum powder on hand. Maybe carry extra t-shirts to change into . Make sure your car has air conditioning . The police sometimes use a tube that conducts air from the car's vent up under the vest . Surf the web sites on this subject ; some dealers post good info .

Side Note : There's a reason the FBI agents in the 1986 Miami shootout were not all wearing vests : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlSCE88UhyA

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Old 03-26-2013, 04:36 AM   #32
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Nutnfancy just did a video on body armor. It's not about concealable armor (he's making one soon), but there is a pretty cool new manufacturer making some sweet new, lightweight Level IIIA and Level III plate armor by DKX Products.

http://youtu.be/lqmFjEQGI9Q

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Old 03-26-2013, 04:34 PM   #33
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If anyone thinks they need to carry a gun with them everywhere, then I really don't understand the level of opposition to wearing body armor everywhere. Since there's very few restrictions with respect to wearing body armor, as opposed to carrying a handgun which carries lots of restrictions with it, it makes more sense to me to always have armor. As I've stated before, the whole point to having a handgun is having a portable, always available means of self-protection from armed criminals who may be stronger, faster, better trained or more experienced, and more numerous than you.

Between being hot and uncomfortable and being alive or crapping in a bag for the rest of my life, I'll choose hot and uncomfortable every time. I've never found carrying a full size handgun to be incredibly comfortable or convenient, but that's not why I carry one. I'm not sure what type of vest others are wearing or have worn, but the woven Twaron vest I purchased is about as comfortable as body armor gets.

If for no other reason but home defense against armed intruders, it would make just as much sense to me to have a good vest next to the nightstand as a good shotgun or AR-15.

Apart from that, my reason for wearing one as much as possible is the same as my reason for carrying a gun as much as possible. From experience, nobody says "get ready" before they attack you. Both serve the same purpose, in my opinion, which is to assist you with surviving an armed confrontation when strong words and running away fail or are not feasible.

As far as range use is concerned, the number of people who have no business using a firearm has exploded because Obama and the Democrats decided they knew what was best for everyone else. I'd say the plan backfired. Disarming the American people has always been a top priority for the socialists. It's really hard to subjugate a people who are well armed, as Iraq and Afghanistan have shown us.

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Old 03-26-2013, 07:04 PM   #34
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I think wearing ever day is a bit extreme. The odds of drawing on anyone when you're CC are really very slim. Even the LEOs I know don't wear if they aren't on duty.
However at the range, I really think it's becoming more and more necessary as you noted above. I got muzzle swept again this morning by a guy who was working with an instructor! Instructor took it in stride and reminded him to keep the muzzle always pointed down range. Me - very dirty look at both of them. The instructor's comment later to him was "we just need to get you qualified." Presuming this was for a Chicago permit. I was tempted to turn and tell him "you just need to teach him basic firearm safety first."

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Old 03-26-2013, 09:52 PM   #35
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Being ex-military special operations and an LEO I have worn almost all kinds of body armor out there. Yeah there is usually a 5 year warranty on the body armor and that is when we always replace ours but you have to remember we wear it all the time, constantly sweating and such. The armor of the vest getting wet can cause it to harden and weaken it, that's why if you ever get a second chance vest wet it is trash so you gotta be careful with used armor. It is worth it to have a custom fit vest and pay the little extra money tho for comfortability tho trust me. I wear a IIIA and am comfortable it will stop most anything I might encounter, I have taken an old worn out one to the range myself and tested it. As I wear mine all the time for work I will throw it out there that it is not the most comfortable, and especially in the summertime it is very hot because it does not breath at all, but it is easily concealed too. I do not wear mine off duty as it is just too much for me having to wear it all the time anyway, I don't see the benefit. If I am going to be in a situation where it is possible I may need it I would probably wear it, but not for everyday use. I could see it being a good idea at a range and have in fact worn mine to a range I go to close to my house, it is an outdoor unmonitored public range. I wear my armor and am always yelling at people out there and coaching them as I can, I am a firearms instructor and always wear it when dealing with new shooters because they don't know any better at first and will do stupid things, all it takes is one split second you aren't paying attention and bam, you have been hit, I have had it almost happen several times dealing with new students. Just my 2 cents....

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Old 03-27-2013, 04:56 AM   #36
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How do you keep it from getting wet? I live in FL and it rains almost everyday in the afternoon.

How do you feel about IIA? I want the most concealable possible and heat is a really big issue for me.

Also, how do they conceal while wearing dress clothes? I frequently wear dress slacks and a button down shirt tucked in. It's all lightweight material bc of where I live. How well could you conceal it wearing cargo shorts and a t shirt?

What brand/brands would you recommend and why?

Thanks for your service and thanks for the info.

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Old 03-28-2013, 01:50 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by 1911love View Post
How do you keep it from getting wet? I live in FL and it rains almost everyday in the afternoon.

How do you feel about IIA? I want the most concealable possible and heat is a really big issue for me.

Also, how do they conceal while wearing dress clothes? I frequently wear dress slacks and a button down shirt tucked in. It's all lightweight material bc of where I live. How well could you conceal it wearing cargo shorts and a t shirt?

What brand/brands would you recommend and why?

Thanks for your service and thanks for the info.
Well I will clarify a bit here to let you know it takes a lot of water to ruin most vests, I sweat like crazy in the summer and have also spent a lot of time in rain varying from light drizzle to pouring down rain without a raincoat and my armor has still survived. Depending on the brand of armor it usually would have to be left open in the pouring rain or submersed to actually harm it.

As far as the II, IIA and IIIA ratings go, either one will most effectively stop whatever you are hit with, be it knife, shotgun, pistol, etc, even a level II will protect you from +P rounds. Not to confuse, the rating is more so based on the blunt force trauma protection not penetration. So in other words, a II will still stop what a IIIA will, but the damage it is going to allow to you from the force of the impact will hurt a lot more, meaning a quicker recovery from a hit generally with the higher rating and less damage to you, such as broken bones, bruises etc. Don't get me wrong taking a hit hurts like hell no matter what and you are gonna be injured either way, but less with the higher rating generally. So you will most likely recover faster to return fire wearing a IIIA vs lower ratings because the vest will absorb more of the impact. If you want the most concealable possible you will wanna stick with level II, not generally used anymore so most places you have to special order it, it will be lighter, easier to conceal, etc.

Concealment wearing dress clothes, you have to wear an undershirt, the vest, then your main button shirt, etc. Same with cargo shorts and a t-shirt, it would be an under shirt, vest, then regular shirt, but all of which of course add to the heat you are going to experience from added layers. If I wanna conceal, I wear 5.11 tac pants etc so I don't do the shorts thing, wear a lightweight moisture wicking undershirt, vest, then regular shirt which for me would be a dept logo polo or such.

As far as brands I have no particular favorite one, my actual work fitted vest is a concealable custom fitted galls by point blank brand because that's what my department buys us and I like it just fine and it has worked perfectly for me for many many years with no issues. My personal custom fitted vest I bought myself is also a point blank. It usually doesn't matter much on the brand honestly because they are all tested to the same specs but the quality of the carrier is different between brands. For example regular galls brand carriers are cheaper made than a point blank or higher brand and pretty much all it is honestly the straps that hold your vest to you and the velcro are just cheaper and wear out a little quicker, but carriers themselves are easy to replace. Also FYI I like the ability to add the optional trauma plates to my front of my carrier, you can get soft or hard plates offering extra protection but it only usually covers a small portion of your chest, but in my opinion worth it and I use the hard plates.

Anymore questions or clarification feel free to ask if I have not made it clear enough or answered your questions properly, I hope that I have. Thank you, I hope this helps with your decision. Oh and by the way from my experience, just cut the stupid front and rear flaps off of whatever carrier you get, tucking them in does not do anything in my experience to keep the vest from moving or anything, you just gotta make sure the vest is fitted to you and strapped to you securely.
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Old 03-28-2013, 02:27 AM   #38
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1911love :
Here's a site with lots of info : http://www.safeguardarmor.com/body-armor-levels/

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Old 03-28-2013, 03:29 AM   #39
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Thanks Custom and Renta, this subject has been difficult to research and I can't find many people to get advice from. You guys are really helping to put me in the right direction.

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Old 03-28-2013, 03:59 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1911love View Post
Thanks Custom and Renta, this subject has been difficult to research and I can't find many people to get advice from. You guys are really helping to put me in the right direction.
No problem brother, that is what we are here for and I like to offer up info that I know to try and help a fellow enthusiast and gun lover in any way I can. That's the only way we can make it in this world, gotta share and help each other
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