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When the SHTF how much is enough...


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Old 08-15-2008, 06:37 PM   #31
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Some good ideas here, and makes for a good read. Here's some things that one might consider as well.....

1. Are you bugging in or staying put? If staying put, do you have an egress plan? Is it supported by cached supplies?...(Ammo/weapons/food/water, etc)

2. Are you rollin solo, with a family group, or plan to "clan up" with 2 or more family groups? If so, how are they armed? ( ammo compatability for example)

3. What plans do you have to have to procure water and food? ( Fishing, hunting, crops, livestock, etc...) Food preperation?

4. Terrain, and weather/seasonal in your AO.

5. Possible threats, freindlies, etc...

Just a few off the top of my head, and might help when deciding on what weapon types are most needed, and why.

My group has already sold off what we didnt need, and used the funds to support what we feel we do need. (Most $$ went to ammo instead of more weapons.)
In our paticular case, we decided on 308 for our primary centerfire caliber, 12ga. for shotguns,and 22lr for rimfire. The latest weapon we let go was the M1Carbine. At present time, we are considering the handgun centerfire. (9mm/38spl/357mag.) Keep both, or decide on one.
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Old 08-23-2008, 06:26 PM   #32
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you should get a mosin nagant M44

you'll hit stuff 400-500 yards with a basic scope and you can get the thing for like 100 bux

or get a remy 710. those are good, and with a nice scope and some practice, you can be hitting as far as 700 yards
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Old 05-10-2009, 03:36 PM   #33
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The good thing about getting a Mosin, a Mauser, or an Enfield was the price. I picked up 5 Enfields 2 in 7.62(NATO) and 3 in .303 Brit. I paid if I remember correctly about $425 for all of them. Now they the local guns shops want at least $300 for one.The Mauser is going for I think $300 here at the gun shop. The only cheap rifle is the Mosin something like $120 I think. Then there is the ammo, it is getting harder to find like all other ammo and it is expensive. But no one said shooting was cheap. FUN but not CHEAP
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Old 05-15-2009, 01:47 AM   #34
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My big question is how much S and how big is the Fan? How long will the world be in disorder and how widespread will the disorder be. It's interesting to come up with all kinds of strategies and tactics for holding down Fortress Suburbia against hordes of looters. But, I suspect that when law and order is restored, you might have some explaining to do if your house is surrounded by bodies.

I don't think that you need anything more than you would normally need to defend your home against home invaders. You might add a .22 to hunt for food with.
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Old 05-18-2009, 11:03 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost Rider View Post
I have to cast another vote for an AR-15. As an LEO, I had 3 guns in my patrol unit besides my 1911 duty sidearm:
Remington 870 14" barrel .12 ga.
Colt M-4 Carbine .223
Remington 700 LTR .308 Sniper Rifle.

All of them are well suited to a combat/hostile situation, but if I could only grab one on my way to a fight, it would have been the black rifle. Personally, I think every home defense strategy should have one available.
AGREE... One good Black Rifle in every home.
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Old 05-22-2009, 03:31 PM   #36
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Default When it happens, the Costco crowd will freeze...

Two thoughts...

First, when it happens here---and it can and will... When it happens here, the mall rats and Costco crowd will get that deer in the headlights look and freeze as they watch their daughters and wives raped. They will be so shocked that this could be happening to them in a world where they were promised the gummint would take care of and protect them that they will just wait to die.

Second, as Coop said, the most important weapon is the warrior mind set. I'll add knowledge to that. Yes have a gun or a dozen and ammo and gear. Yes, practice---and not just shooting. Be able to load and clear your gun in the dark. Practice snatching a pistol out of your partner's hand in a heart beat. It can be done and many fools think putting a pistol close is the way to intimidate. Try it by twisting the gun toward the man's body. It's amazing. Yes, I know, you can get shot that way---or any other way. As Al Pacino said in Heat: You can get killed walkin your doggie.

But give me a Costco drone with a bunch of new guns and a man and an old warrior who has only empty hands and I'll put my money on the latter every time. What about you?
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Old 05-22-2009, 03:53 PM   #37
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As stated before, when you think you have enough, triple it!! Then re-evaluate your supplies every month and determine if you have enough. The how much S and how big is the FAN question is entirely relevant.

Choose the worst case scenario and think real hard about how you are going to weather that storm, protect your family, feed and shelter your group.

Uncommon ammo can be hard to find after a few months where .308, .223 and 9mm should be readily available; one way or another.
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Old 07-14-2009, 02:48 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost Rider View Post
I have to cast another vote for an AR-15. As an LEO, I had 3 guns in my patrol unit besides my 1911 duty sidearm:
Remington 870 14" barrel .12 ga.
Colt M-4 Carbine .223
Remington 700 LTR .308 Sniper Rifle.

All of them are well suited to a combat/hostile situation, but if I could only grab one on my way to a fight, it would have been the black rifle. Personally, I think every home defense strategy should have one available.
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AGREE... One good Black Rifle in every home.
I got 4. But don't be coming by my place.
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Old 07-14-2009, 06:53 PM   #39
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Default Consider your enemy...

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Originally Posted by supergus View Post
I have a Mossberg 500 with tactical light, pistol grip and buttstock shell holder. I also have a .45 auto and a S&W 686 Plus 7 shot. Oh yeah, and my wife's J-Frame .38 +p. I was considering getting a mid range rifle; I don't think I need one that'll hit out to 600 yds.(or do I?) but something that'll hit out farther than my Mossy. Do I need a rifle or should I save my $ and start socking away ammo for the guns I already have? Gimme some thoughts.
I think we're assuming something along the lines of a financial crash, followed by government control over most everything. If so, then I'll carry what the government will be carrying. You can Wolverine a convoy, grab their stuff and use it in your own weapon.

A .223 SBR (or a .223 pistol - saves you the Class III trouble, and you can always add the stock after the SHFT) can fit under your coat so you don't draw attention, can be maneuvered in a car, and can still make headshots out to 200 yards or so. I doubt few have the skills to do much better, nor do I anticipate the need to do so. If the enemy is 500 yards away, I'm going to let them walk on by. Why bring unnecessary attention be engagement?

You have the .357, so that you and your wife can share her ammo, but you'll have enough knockdown power with the 686 if needed. As such, I'd forgo the .45. I know, we all love it, but you have to think in different terms now.

If you're thinking that the SHTF scenario will be long-term, then a Savage 24 in your calibers of choice might be the best option. The .22/.410 combo is the one I see most often, though there are many variants of that model. If you're nasty rich, a German Drilling (3 barrels, in any combination of rifle & shotgun calibers) can be had.

I think we would need to know where you are (city vs. rural), how you plan to ride it out (do you have your site located and plotted yet?), if you have a family, etc. All those factors will impact your final choice, as well as our recommendations.

IMHO, run and hide out in the bushes/mountains as long as you can. My case is simple: I'm single and I have some medical issues. I don't think I could last long without my meds, but I might if the situation were truly horrendous. I can only have a 1 month supply at any time, so I don't have to pack much else beyond that. If I get lucky and snag an extra month or two of meds, I can forage for that long. If I don't get the extra meds, I'd have to consider giving up and hoping for treatment. Sux to get old!
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Old 07-19-2009, 02:30 AM   #40
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Default Do I use a #7 Iron or a #9 Iron?

My thought is simply that you shouldn't really need a caddy to carry all your guns.

If you have to bug out, guns are heavy, ammunition is heavy, water is heavy, and other survival supplies are heavy. Heavy means that you have to have a bigger vehicle. A bigger vehicle means lower fuel economy. If you have lower fuel economy, you have to carry more fuel or forage for more fuel. Look at the sticker inside your car door. How much weight is your vehicle rated to carry? How much space is left after each person in your family has a shotgun, a pistol, a rifle, and a bolt gun and ammunition for each?

I think each family member should use the gun that they are most comfortable with. If your family ends up engaging in firefights on a regular basis, it's likely that at least one family member will get seriously hurt or killed. If you suspect that your area is that dangerous, you are probably better off planning to bug out when the bugging is good.

If you live in a low crime area now and the community is filled with decent law-abiding people, if the S hits the fan, the community will likely work together to overcome the challenge. If you live in a high crime area now, the community will probably come and try to kill you and take your TV if the S hits the fan. If the S hits the fan, I am not going to become a murderer just because I am hungry. I'll go hunting, fishing, and try to grow some food.

In addition, the money you spend on guns might also be better spent on a generator or solar cells, agricultural supplies, land in the country, a pop-up trailer, or some other survival gear. If your neighborhood organizes for survival, it will be good to have some guns around. But, the guy with a rotor tiller and some gas is going to be pretty popular.

Last edited by GatorDude; 07-19-2009 at 02:35 AM.
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