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Old 08-19-2012, 10:05 PM   #11
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Level 5 is when any of levels 1-4 affect ME.

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Old 08-19-2012, 10:16 PM   #12
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Level 5 is when any of levels 1-4 affect ME.
LOL - Best description yet.
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Old 08-19-2012, 10:56 PM   #13
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Tragedy is when Level 5 affects me. Comedy is when Level 5 affects someone else.
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Old 08-19-2012, 10:57 PM   #14
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Double post

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Old 08-19-2012, 10:59 PM   #15
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Tragedy is when Level 5 affects me. Comedy is when Level 5 affects someone else.
Preferably my ex. Or your ex (I assume you have one? Don't know much about you obviously... ) or winds' ex. ALL THREE TOGETHER AT THE SAME TIME!! The epitome of epicness.
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Old 08-19-2012, 11:41 PM   #16
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SHTF means SHTF. So you can have varying levels of scope for SHTF.

1. Personal SHTF: both you and your spouse lose your jobs, or there's a serious medical emergency, or the death of a loved one (particularly a breadwinner), or a fire/tornado/whatever destroys your home.

2. Localized SHTF: ice storm knocks out power in your area (say a county or three in size). Stores are not operating. Traveling is difficult due to downed trees and power lines. Natural gas works, but furnace fans are down. Landline phones are down and cell phone service is very spotty. Water is iffy. (This one happened to me back in 1991.)

3. Regional SHTF: Much larger storm event - eg. hurricane - affecting large portion of a state or states taking out power and shutting down utilities while trashing homes and businesses. Being able to get immediate care or help impossible. Epidemic is another potential cause.

4. National SHTF: Series of terror attacks result in many areas without power or other utilities. Travel is restricted. Communications are down. Or, economic situation results in either entitlement program cuts or the inflation of the dollar to the point where entitlement hand-outs won't buy what people need resulting in severe and widespread civil unrest and violence, mostly limited to big cities. This results in the markets closing and many businesses being directly or indirectly impacted and the cascading effect causes just about everyone to feel pain. Pandemic is another potential cause.

5. Global SHTF: World War III with nuclear weapons, or an entire collapse of the world's economy (see above about riots), or some cataclysmic natural event (Yellowstone pops its lid or an asteroid parks on Siberia). Short and long term food production and distribution shut down. Water, power, fuel, everything is shut down indefinitely.



For the person in the middle of the event, the S has really HTF. The lower the scope of the problem, the faster others will be able to come to your aid and get you back to normal. In a personal or localized SHTF, having a supply of food and a way to heat your home for a matter of weeks or months will help defray costs or keep you comfortable. A regional SHTF will test your ability to know when to bug out (assuming there's any warning) and your ability to store what you need securely. It will also test your ability to think on your feet: if your home has been wiped out and all your supplies are gone, what knowledge do you have in your head at that moment to begin getting things back together? A global SHTF pretty much means all bets are off, but having an independent means of communication, transportation, arms, food, water, medical and other supplies and the ability to meet up with others who you trust and who are similarly prepared and have experience, training and knowledge to work in a bad situation wouldn't hurt.

EDIT: Other things to think about: prepping works only when your preps haven't been destroyed and when you're able to get to them when the SHTF. But no matter what, the most important thing to have in every situation is the ability to rationally and calmly assess the situation and have the knowledge to know how to react and what to do.

You can't really say "Oh, you have six months of preps. You're at level X." What if those preps get destroyed or stolen or you're 500 miles away from them when the SHTF? Having two years of food won't keep you happy for long if the infrastructure - roads, power, supermarkets, etc. - won't come back up for five years and you don't know how to grow food, hunt or fish.

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Old 08-20-2012, 12:07 AM   #17
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All good points. It has been said it is comedy when the OTHER guy's pants are on fire- tragedy when it's YOUR pants!

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Old 08-20-2012, 12:20 AM   #18
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. . . . . .2. Localized SHTF: ice storm knocks out power in your area (say a county or three in size). Stores are not operating. Traveling is difficult due to downed trees and power lines. Natural gas works, but furnace fans are down. Landline phones are down and cell phone service is very spotty. Water is iffy. (This one happened to me back in 1991.)

3. Regional SHTF: Much larger storm event - eg. hurricane - affecting large portion of a state or states taking out power and shutting down utilities while trashing homes and businesses. Being able to get immediate care or help impossible. Epidemic is another potential cause.
I guess we had a Level 3 up here during the Ice Storm of ’98. Didn’t that reach down into Rochester?
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Old 08-20-2012, 02:44 AM   #19
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You could never predict how things would go if SHTF no matter what level, but you can have plans in place for different levels.

It would be good to have a plan to leave the country in case of a natural catastrophe or political one on a national level. Honestly, I've never thought about leaving the country until this thread, but it would be good to have a plan in place for a national event. Again, I can't help but to think about the Jews in Germany before WWII. I can't image that happening, but I'm sure they couldn't either and that's why such plans need to be in place.

A plan to leave the country wouldn't be necessary for a localized disaster, but you might have to leave your region (if possible). Katrina is an obvious example of that, but there are also not so obvious situations in which it would be a good idea to leave. I'm sure Detroit was a nice place to live at one time. I'm also sure that there are a lot of seniors stuck there now that wish they had left back when they could have actually sold their homes. That is an example of a localized economic disaster that some people could have avoided. That's also a mess that any of us could end up in if we aren't paying attention to what's going on.

Classifying events, at least for me, seems to be helpful. Once you identify the scale of an event(s) you better react to it.

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Old 08-20-2012, 03:03 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TLuker
You could never predict how things would go if SHTF no matter what level, but you can have plans in place for different levels.

It would be good to have a plan to leave the country in case of a natural catastrophe or political one on a national level. Honestly, I've never thought about leaving the country until this thread, but it would be good to have a plan in place for a national event. Again, I can't help but to think about the Jews in Germany before WWII. I can't image that happening, but I'm sure they couldn't either and that's why such plans need to be in place.

A plan to leave the country wouldn't be necessary for a localized disaster, but you might have to leave your region (if possible). Katrina is an obvious example of that, but there are also not so obvious situations in which it would be a good idea to leave. I'm sure Detroit was a nice place to live at one time. I'm also sure that there are a lot of seniors stuck there now that wish they had left back when they could have actually sold their homes. That is an example of a localized economic disaster that some people could have avoided. That's also a mess that any of us could end up in if we aren't paying attention to what's going on.

Classifying events, at least for me, seems to be helpful. Once you identify the scale of an event(s) you better react to it.
One huge difference about leaving the country (USA) and Germany or other European countries during or before WWII is geography. For us in the states you have two options that don't require air or boat travel and one those options don't look good. Also the sheer area possibly needed to travel. Say FL to Canada. In Europe countries tend to be the size of states here.
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