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Old 11-23-2011, 12:44 AM   #11
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Sometimes I just wish it would happen so we could get it over with and start rebuilding. I think 5 years is pretty realistic.

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Old 11-23-2011, 12:57 AM   #12
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BKT,

If it collapses here, I don't believe there will be anywhere else to go. US is still the financial center, and when combined with the Euro, the two are 85% of all currency movement. You take either, or both out of the equation, there's nothing left.

hiwall,

This will be over in 12-18 months, no matter who is elected. The damage is already done. I keep hoping someone a lot smarter than I has a plan to fix it, but the people in charge apparently can't...

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Old 11-23-2011, 01:15 AM   #13
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BKT,

If it collapses here, I don't believe there will be anywhere else to go. US is still the financial center, and when combined with the Euro, the two are 85% of all currency movement. You take either, or both out of the equation, there's nothing left.

hiwall,

This will be over in 12-18 months, no matter who is elected. The damage is already done. I keep hoping someone a lot smarter than I has a plan to fix it, but the people in charge apparently can't...
we already have a good system. we just created a few unconstitutional entities (federal reserve, medicare, medicaide, social security, etc) that were allowed by the supreme court to stand. its gonna take blood sweat and tears to correct back to a working nation with part time government
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Old 11-23-2011, 02:36 AM   #14
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Don't underestimate the ability of congress to delay things from happening. They never fix anything but they are masters at delaying stuff. Until after elections or after they leave office.

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Old 11-23-2011, 02:50 PM   #15
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Read this. It Makes a lot of sense in today's world. They Know Social Unrest is a Foregone Conclusion

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Old 11-23-2011, 02:52 PM   #16
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Old 11-23-2011, 03:12 PM   #17
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In a nutshell:
  • A recent partial audit of the Federal Reserve revealed it has spent $16 trillion in bail-outs to foreign banks and corporations and that money is guaranteed by the U.S. taxpayer (that's us);
  • Congress has spent several trillion more dollars on bail-outs - some publicized, some not - to U.S. and foreign banks and the taxpayer is once again on the hook;
  • The Federal Reserve is now the official holder of the most U.S. debt and they are issuing credit and currency on behalf of the U.S. which means they are monetizing our debt - the more debt they acquire the more currency they issue, establishing very firmly that our money today is based on debt: future labor of Americans...so taxpayers are on the hook once again;
  • Formulas used to calculate inflation and unemployment have been altered over the years to make the numbers look better than they really are: unemployment is nearer 16% and inflation is significantly higher if you include the cost of food and energy (which they don't in the official calculation);
  • Our Gross Domestic Product is very inflated due to the bail-out spending and our actual economic growth is probably far below the recently-revised (downward) 2% which means we are producing less and less wealth which means the prospect of ever being able to pay off this enormous debt is non-existent;
  • Several American banks and foreign banks holding derivatives and assets of American origin have hundreds of trillions of dollars at stake;
  • Very few people in congress understand economics and if they did, they would still allow their political agenda to trump doing what must be done (assuming anything can be done) to begin to fix this mess. In all honesty, it can't be fixed without a major reset which could certainly happen;
  • The president of the United States is unquestionably actively and deliberately working very hard to collapse the U.S. economy;
  • None of the big banks care about a U.S. collapse because they will move to Asia next and feast there for a few decades.

Our monetary and regulatory system permits non-government entities to create money. The temptation to do this is overwhelming and so it goes unchecked until we land where we are today. Tell me, how can a private bank rack up several hundred trillion dollars - many tens or hundreds of times the entire U.S. GDP - worth of potentially toxic derivatives and involve foreign central banks without government intervention?? How can the Federal Reserve, which is a group of private banks operating in a mercantile fashion for the government, unilaterally give $16 trillion to foreigners without our vote or our consent, yet we are legally obligated to cover the value of that money?

A sound monetary system where the dollar is backed by something you cannot print and you cannot create by a keystroke or mouse-click is the only way to prevent this kind of insanity. Gold-backed money is NOT a solution to every problem and different problems from what we face today will come up from time to time. But, we have seen those problems before and we know they can be (self-)corrected but we can be far more certain that banks will not create debt to the degree they have today and that the global banking cartel would be minus one player: us. I'm pretty sure the fallout from this will be a gold standard or some variation.

The S has been hitting the fan for a while but some of us are only noticing now that we're getting freckles. It will get worse before it gets better.

If you're worried about how stable the dollar is, that's smart. It might be fine forever, or it might fall pretty quickly. Other currencies in the recent and distant past have gone from being stable to being worthless in the span of only a few weeks. I suggest you hold some wealth in something other than dollars.
You seem really willing to blame the POTUS for the economic problems; yet you don't say anything about the congress who actually writes the budget and passes the laws. I don't get it. The POTUS can only sign legislation, not sign it, or veto it. It is your men in the house that can't do a damn thing.

If Obama came up with the perfect economic fix, a cure for cancer, and an end to world hunger, the Republican congress would block it.

Obama hate is a smoke screen to keep your eye off of what is really happening to your country. Hitler said; The larger the lie, the more readily the masses will accept it.
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Old 11-23-2011, 03:44 PM   #18
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You seem really willing to blame the POTUS for the economic problems; yet you don't say anything about the congress who actually writes the budget and passes the laws. I don't get it. The POTUS can only sign legislation, not sign it, or veto it. It is your men in the house that can't do a damn thing.

If Obama came up with the perfect economic fix, a cure for cancer, and an end to world hunger, the Republican congress would block it.

Obama hate is a smoke screen to keep your eye off of what is really happening to your country. Hitler said; The larger the lie, the more readily the masses will accept it.
Yuo never heard of Exe. orders?

Obama has gone around cangress so much it is unbeleavable!
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Old 11-23-2011, 05:14 PM   #19
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Yuo never heard of Exe. orders?

Obama has gone around cangress so much it is unbeleavable!
So, you think he should fix the economy by going around congress? Rule by executive order? I like the man, but not that much.
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Old 11-23-2011, 05:18 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Chainfire View Post
You seem really willing to blame the POTUS for the economic problems; yet you don't say anything about the congress who actually writes the budget and passes the laws. I don't get it. The POTUS can only sign legislation, not sign it, or veto it. It is your men in the house that can't do a damn thing.

If Obama came up with the perfect economic fix, a cure for cancer, and an end to world hunger, the Republican congress would block it.

Obama hate is a smoke screen to keep your eye off of what is really happening to your country. Hitler said; The larger the lie, the more readily the masses will accept it.
Who are "my men" in the House? There's Ron Paul...maybe a couple others, and no, they can't do a damn thing because there aren't more like them.

I blame Obama for having signed laws that spent more money than all other presidencies combined.

I blame Bush for getting the ball rolling in regard to the Prescription Drug plan, bail-outs, TARP, etc.

I blame the Federal Reserve for spending $16 trillion with no oversight.

I blame Congress for pandering to voters with bribes.

And we can go back at least as far as Wilson and lay blame in that era and find all sorts of inane, illegal and costly moves that have contributed to our problem.

It's past time you put away the partisan bullsh!t, chainfire, and got with the program. It isn't about Republicans versus Democrats anymore. When someone is critical of Obama that doesn't mean they're fighting for the Republican team.
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