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243 ammo?


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Old 12-14-2012, 05:01 PM   #31
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Cotton,
If you take the time and do a little research with an OPENMIND you will see where I am coming from.
It is universally excepted that a 'big' game bullet should have a minimum sectional density (SD) of at least .250. Now with the modern bullet technology, bounded, partitioned, and monolithic hollow point bullets, you can 'fudge' a little on that but not much.
The UPPER limits of the 6mm/.243 is the 100 gr bullet, SD .242!!!!
Compare his to the best hunting bullets in .264, the light one the 129 gr SD is .264, the 140 gr SD is .287. The .277 light one, 130 gr, is the same as a 100gr .243 at .242 (which is why I do not use them, I prefer the 140 gr with a SD of .261 and 150 gr with a SD of .279). The .284/7mm the same goes here the lowest SD here, once again is the same as the HIGHEST in the .243 with the 139 gr coming in with a SD of .246, and the 154 coming in with a SD of .273 and the 160, my preference, with a SD of .287. The .308's are similar with the 165 gr with a SD of .248. The .308 in a 150 only has a SD of .228 but it still way out performs the 100 gr .243 because of it's weight! The 180 in the 308 has a SD of .271.
It boils down to the totality of the circumstances, in this case when you have a light bullet (100 gr), low SD (.242), you get a bullet which has very little 'momentum' (mass x velocity) which results in a lack of the bullets ability to 'penetrate', and the only reason it has fair energy (mass x velocity squared) numbers is it's velocity is high at the muzzle. Because of it's lack of weight (momentum) it MUST be relegated to only PERFECT broadside shots at close to medium ranges on big game.
If you want to shot at longer ranges and/or take quartering shots it is not acceptable if you believe in HUMANLY harvesting a big game animal. Thus it is a MARGINAL 'big game' round!
If I had more time I would address the BC and time of flight (Drift and drop) issues.
If it is possible for you to loose the emotion, myth, and misinformation surrounding the .243 and take an OPENMINDED objective look at the FACTS you will come to he same conclusion I have!
I will take small deer IF you have he discipline to use it within the 'marginal circumstances' it will preform!
Have a nice day, and a MERRY CHRISTMAS!
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Old 12-14-2012, 10:04 PM   #32
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Jim, you have proved my point, as I knew you would. BTW, what you have stated above again is all opinion. You only give S.D. numbers of various bullets. You say that a certain S.D. is needed and is "universally accepted." By who? Who said it? When? From what publication and give quotes please.
You say the the .277 (.270) bullet has a S.D. the same as the 100 grain .243 bullet and that is why you don't use them. Well, who are you? What did you write? Tell that to Jack O'Conner. You, sir, are no Jack O'Conner. Jack O'Conner used the 130 grain .270 bullet almost exclusively and I guess that the countless numbers of deer antelope and sheep that he took did not know that the 130 grain .270 bullet S.D. was not right for them. You also set yourself up to be an authority by saying "I prefer," and "I do not use them," and "my preference," and on and on. And still no facts. Stop wasting your time and just give it up. Open mindedness is one thing and countless statements from successful hunters and countless pictures of very dead one shot .243 killed deer is another.
cottontop

Last edited by cottontop; 12-15-2012 at 03:03 AM. Reason: added
 
 
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:17 PM   #33
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Cotton,
You have obviously 'closed' your mind so there no way to convince you of the facts. But you are not why I post this information here. I know there are people like you who will not chance no mater what is said. I post here for the hundreds if not thousands of others who use the Internet to gain information and get advise.
Just remember, 'You can violate the laws of man and get away with it most of the time, but you can not violate the laws of science and get away with it ever!'
I never did say a 243 would not kill a deer. You can pound in a 16 penny nail with a tack hammer if you so choose, but it is not the right tool for the job, it is marginal for that application.
Nuff said, have a nice day.
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:53 PM   #34
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Folks, open mindedness does not mean someone has to win an argument or change their way of thinking.

Now, I should be one to talk, huh?

Have a good day gents.
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Old 12-15-2012, 03:09 PM   #35
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To Jim,
As one professional writer to another, please let us know when your next article is coming out and in what publication.
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Old 12-15-2012, 08:09 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cottontop View Post
To Jim,
As one professional writer to another, please let us know when your next article is coming out and in what publication.
cottontop
What does this have to do with the facts here?? But I will let you know when I get enough time to do some more writing and submit it.
Like I said, I am simply giving information and advise here. It is up to the reader to use it or to disregard. I am not trying to make anyone posting here 'change their minds'. It is human nature to not want to admit to being wrong. If you think the 243 is the 'lightning bolt' for deer so be it.
The facts don't back that up, but who am I to confuse this discussion by using facts with a distinguished writer like you! Sorry if I hurt your feelings.
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Old 12-15-2012, 09:26 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by JimRau View Post
What does this have to do with the facts here?? But I will let you know when I get enough time to do some more writing and submit it.
Like I said, I am simply giving information and advise here. It is up to the reader to use it or to disregard. I am not trying to make anyone posting here 'change their minds'. It is human nature to not want to admit to being wrong. If you think the 243 is the 'lightning bolt' for deer so be it.
The facts don't back that up, but who am I to confuse this discussion by using facts with a distinguished writer like you! Sorry if I hurt your feelings.

No hurt feelings here. This whole thing started by you saying that the .243 was a "marginal" round. I and a few others do not agree. I never said that it was the (double quotation marks btw, not single ones) "lightning bolt" for deer. I only said that it was not marginal. You have set yourself up to be an "expert" on the subject comparable to a published gun writer, so I interjected a little sarcasim. Sorry if that bothers you. But, you still refuse to post any facts backed up by work cited credits. You still only give opinions. Facts are all we are asking for. Just admit that the reason that you give no facts is because there are not any. I tried to end this discussion several threads ago and I gave you a way out; but, no, you have to continue your thin dataless point of view as if you are right when the majority of posters here disagree with you. So, maybe the above is your way out: you said that we can accept in or reject it. We choose to reject it. Case closed. Moderators, please put a lock on this thread. The subject has been well covered. I am done.
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Old 12-18-2012, 02:38 AM   #38
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Me too.
Merry Christmas all!
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:10 PM   #39
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Wooh. glad that one ended peacefully, I think.
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Old 12-21-2012, 12:42 AM   #40
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Its also good for wolfs also.
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