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-   -   IDPA is it worth it (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f48/idpa-worth-78080/)

John_Deer 12-09-2012 11:38 AM

IDPA is it worth it
 
I shot my first IDPA match yesterday. Today, I have serious doubts about IDPA being helpful in self defense training. A Ruger P95 is my EDC. The P95 has a heavy DA trigger so I never engage the decocker when the gun is holstered. When I unload the weapon I use the decocker to let the hammer fall.

During the match I had to engage the decocker. Naturally, I spent more time fumbling with the decocker than actually shooting. When a shooter finishes the course the safety officer wants you to empty the weapon and dry fire it. I have become accustomed to using the decocker to let the hammer fall. Most of the six stations I had to pull the hammer back to dry fire because I used the decocker let the hammer fall by instinct.

While I wholeheartedly agree with the safety measures for a gun range. In real gunfight I am not sure they are something I want to become habitual. Especially dry firing the weapon to prove it is empty. At some point the weapon isn't going to be empty. Life isn't a range. There might be someone I love down range when I pull the trigger instead of safely decocking the weapon.

SSGN_Doc 12-09-2012 02:50 PM

For training I would continue to do what you are doing as far as deco king when you are done firing. Then you can go through the tougher manipulations separately for the safety officers at the match after your string of fire.

I would ask at the next match about the possibility of putting your pistol in your preferred carry mode once you are on the line and asked to "make ready". They may allow you to disengage your decocker's active safety once you are on the line and they see that the hammer is already lowered. This is just a suggestion though. Some line coaches may fully understand the safety on your pistol while others won't. Some may claim it to be an advantage in the competition aspect. I run a Glock so there is no confusion, and you could argue that it gives a competitive advantage over folks with manual safeties.

Axxe55 12-09-2012 03:05 PM

first of all, IDPA is competition shooting, not self defence training. two very different disciplines going on. personally IMO, they are not interchangeable, and nor should they be.

winds-of-change 12-09-2012 03:49 PM

Balota here shoots IDPA. His trip to come visit was delayed a couple days because he wanted to shoot a Qualifier today. Ask him about IDPA. He seems to really enjoy the competitive shooting.

John_Deer 12-09-2012 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSGN_Doc (Post 1045299)
For training I would continue to do what you are doing as far as deco king when you are done firing. Then you can go through the tougher manipulations separately for the safety officers at the match after your string of fire.

I would ask at the next match about the possibility of putting your pistol in your preferred carry mode once you are on the line and asked to "make ready". They may allow you to disengage your decocker's active safety once you are on the line and they see that the hammer is already lowered. This is just a suggestion though. Some line coaches may fully understand the safety on your pistol while others won't. Some may claim it to be an advantage in the competition aspect. I run a Glock so there is no confusion, and you could argue that it gives a competitive advantage over folks with manual safeties.

I ended up with an accidental discharge on the first bay. They all know I am green as grass about the entire range experience. It was just pure nerves. I forgot to pull the slide back to eject the round in the chamber. I pointed the gun down range and pulled the trigger. Blam!

They said I was done for the day. I asked how I am supposed to learn if you are sending me home. They replied you won't do it again. They are correct. I won't do it again. Because I am not going back.

I asked the range officer and range owner about the decocker. They both said if the weapon has a safety device you have to use it.

I could get around most of the things that are troubling me by shooting a revolver. I just want to have fun. I don't care about the competitive aspects. My 9mm is cheap and fun to shoot. If it's not as much fun as I want to have I have the right to spend my money elsewhere.

winds-of-change 12-09-2012 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John_Deer (Post 1045605)
I ended up with an accidental discharge on the first bay. They all know I am green as grass about the entire range experience. It was just pure nerves. I forgot to pull the slide back to eject the round in the chamber. I pointed the gun down range and pulled the trigger. Blam!

They said I was done for the day. I asked how I am supposed to learn if you are sending me home. They replied you won't do it again. They are correct. I won't do it again. Because I am not going back.

Please give them another chance. I hear they are very strict with safety and I think they should be. Maybe go and observe for a couple times to see how it goes and what is expected of the shooters. I think you might be giving up on a great opportunity to broaden your shooting experiences.

John_Deer 12-09-2012 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winds-of-change (Post 1045618)
Please give them another chance. I hear they are very strict with safety and I think they should be. Maybe go and observe for a couple times to see how it goes and what is expected of the shooters. I think you might be giving up on a great opportunity to broaden your shooting experiences.

You might be right, WOC. This weekend was a bummer. They say it's up to me the shooter to learn the rules. I asked how do I get instruction. They reply read the rules. I am thinking "Duh! I read the rules at least 10 times before I went there." They (range management) are just poor communicators.

The next few weeks the matches are for law enforcement. There will be a lot of people there I know. When it's all law enforcement I will be forced to watch. I will share my experience I had today with them. With any luck, one of them will take me under their wing.

willfully armed 12-09-2012 08:05 PM

That was not an accidental discharge, it was a negligent discharge. ND means shooter error, and IDPA rules state that shooter is disqualified.

I hope you're man enough to admit fault and go back to play the best game that exists.
I an an AVID IDPA shooter with many, many, many local, state and national/world matches attended across the US.

be careful, take your time. That's the most important advice for the new shooter. Make safety a habit.


BTW, I was wrongly disqualified at a state match this year for an AD by malfunction. My G34 slamfired at load and make ready. The SO told me to take my finger off the trigger. I held the gun up to his face showing him my finger was safely rested on the SLIDE. The entire squad saw my finger sagely located.

He had already marked the scoresheet, I refused to sign, match director was called to officiate, and wrongly agreed to an incorrect call.

It sucks, but I will go back.

willfully armed 12-09-2012 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John_Deer (Post 1045670)
You might be right, WOC. This weekend was a bummer. They say it's up to me the shooter to learn the rules. I asked how do I get instruction. They reply read the rules. I am thinking "Duh! I read the rules at least 10 times before I went there." They (range management) are just poor communicators

You should keep a Rulebook in your range bag. There should have been a Rulebook available to show you where it was if questioned.

Most ranges also have a safety policy involving Nd's.

I hope you explain this to a LE buddy just the same as you did here. I'd be surprised if he disagreed with the RO/SO. Just like the cops, they are there to enforce the rules, not interpret or babysit.

SSGN_Doc 12-09-2012 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by axxe55 (Post 1045312)
first of all, IDPA is competition shooting, not self defence training. two very different disciplines going on. personally IMO, they are not interchangeable, and nor should they be.

True it is not self defense training. However for new shooters it can be an effective way to practice basics of drawing, disengaging a safety, engaging targets while having to practice marksmanship basics, and then safely return the weapon to the holster.

It does not replace training, but it can be used as effective practice within its limits.

To the OP: it seems like you may have a bit to learn. Every shooter starts out with a lot of room to grow. You already learned what you did wrong on the range in that one event in a controlled environment. It shows how that same loss of focus in a street environment could have had much worse results.

I get your argument about the decocker/safety having to be engaged. It is not necessarily a bad thing to learn how to efficiently disengage your safety from the holster.

Going back and showing improvement will go a lot farther with the folks at the range and in your own self confidence.


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