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Old 04-24-2013, 11:33 PM   #11
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The only way to have a full-auto is to come off your pocket-book and buy one from a licensed class III. Any shortcuts can possibly or maybe probably, cost you ten years in the Federal Government's prison system.

Don't even think about it.

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Old 04-24-2013, 11:34 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by DropZone889 View Post
Now if your a FFL/class 3 dealer can you make a full auto say m4 but you can't transfer it to a private person say with a tax stamp? Is that correct?

Also how is that my LGS/Range can rent out full auto guns? Is there something in a trust/LLC that allows the use of the weapon while in their supervision or is it like a umbrella coverage because wouldn't that be like possession under the BATF?
only FA currently made can go to the military or LEA, no civilian can own or possess anything made after 1986. BATF defines anything able to fire more than one shot per trigger pull as FA. so even an M4 with three round burst capability is defined as FA according to the BATF.

the only way any of us would ever handle a FA M4 is if we join the military or certain LEA's.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:52 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DropZone889
I hope this isn't a stupid question, but if I wanted to make my AR15 to full auto buy installing say for instance a Geissele Super Select-Fire (SSF®) Trigger in my lower, would this be ok if I went through all the Class 3 ATF paperwork or would this fall under manufacturing where I would need to have a class 3 dealer or manufactor perform this and so forth?
Nothing you can do to make an AR full auto is legal...period. You cannot possess a new select fire rifle, only LE agencies and military.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:59 PM   #14
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Second part..........Also how is that my LGS/Range can rent out full auto guns? Is there something in a trust/LLC that allows the use of the weapon while in their supervision or is it like a umbrella coverage because wouldn't that be like possession under the BATF?

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Old 04-25-2013, 12:20 AM   #15
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Second part..........Also how is that my LGS/Range can rent out full auto guns? Is there something in a trust/LLC that allows the use of the weapon while in their supervision or is it like a umbrella coverage because wouldn't that be like possession under the BATF?
There is no problem shooting someone else's legal machine gun. It is not unusual to be able to rent the things at a range. You better have a pile of ammo, 'cause you can burn through some money quick!
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Old 04-25-2013, 12:22 AM   #16
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Nothing you can do to make an AR full auto is legal...period. You cannot possess a new select fire rifle, only LE agencies and military.
Not entirely true when using the registered sears and lightening links previously mentioned. But those are just about as expensive and require the same process as buying a full auto rifle.
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Old 04-25-2013, 12:43 AM   #17
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Speaking of lightning links, has anyone actually seen one that works?

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Old 04-25-2013, 12:49 AM   #18
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Not entirely true when using the registered sears and lightening links previously mentioned. But those are just about as expensive and require the same process as buying a full auto rifle.
Isn't that restricted to a repair to a registered receiver? You cannot create a new FA receiver, correct.
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Old 04-25-2013, 12:51 AM   #19
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Speaking of lightning links, has anyone actually seen one that works?
the few stories i have read about said they were problematic, fragile and rare to find. that's about the extent of my knowledge of them.
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Old 04-25-2013, 01:35 AM   #20
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Isn't that restricted to a repair to a registered receiver? You cannot create a new FA receiver, correct.
No. But the drop in auto sear is a registered part that was manufactured prior to 1986. It is the part the the ATF registers. Think similar to the modular trigger groups that are self contained. It is one of the work arounds that is legal, because they don't alter the firearm itself and they were made before the 1986 ban. There was only one source for them. (One guy bought all of them just prior to the ban). And they only sold a limited number per year to help keep the price up. Made for a nice retirement package, when you could sell 100 of them a year and give yourself between a half to a full million dollar per year income. Owners do occasionally part with them, but the will be sold through a NFA dealer just like a full auto firearm.

This isn't the same as buying a regular M16 fire control group, which does require modifying the firearm.

A guy who used to come out to some monthly shoots near Jacksonville FL had one. He'd let folks try it out with their own ammo. It was pretty fun. There was also a NFA dealer who used to frequent the shoots as well. Lots of toys got sold when folks could try them out. I don't think I have been around so many legal SBRs , SBSs, Suppressors, or legal full autos though as the annual shoots at the Fraternal Order of Police range when they would host full auto events. Of course I've never made the pilgrimage to Knob Creek for their full auto event. I enjoy going and looking but when I see the diet that those beasts eat, I can do the math fast enough to know that I can't afford to buy that much ammo and I don't have enough time to reload that much.
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