[Dillinger]

Originally Posted by SGT-MILLER

Hopefully, wherever it's sold it's marketed as a deterrent, and not a stopper.

Agreed! Misleading information could lead to someone being put in a very bad situation...

JD

[slowryde45]

I think you'd be hard pressed to find any manufacturers out ther who would knowingly stick their necks on the line and state that this type of product is designed to be a 'stopper'. The law suits would follow very quickly.

As was stated, it is primarily designed as another option to 'deadly force', as a deterrent to escalating threat, and to provide you with time to make an escape or to to turn the hand in your favor. A direct blast to the eyes/nasal/mouth area of most folks or animals would definitely slow down or terminate the aggression, as the aggressor would be in some discomfort.

As JD stated, it has some value in the hands of those who might be a little timid to pull a weapon, or think of using a weapon in a threatening situation. They are easy to use, no need to worry about where the safety is, lining up sights, etc. So for most folks they are a no-brainer to use, which in a panic situation is something that could be life saving.

I would definitely say they are USEFUL, not only for those folks but for many of us. I don't carry as much as I used to, but I would carry something like this if I couldn't carry my regular CW.

As for stopping PCP/dusted monsters, it might not stop the attack, but it would make it very hard for the monster to find you, as he would have a heck of a time trying to see and breath, much less worry about where you went. And sorry, but if it took that many shots to stop someone, then there are definitely some training issues involved. When I went through training, 3 shots became second nature to you. It was automatic, and never failed. Those three, center of mass (heart), head, and pelvic area (groin/hip if you could). Whether or not this would have stopped your friend's PCP superman, I don't know. But I'm pretty sure it would have given him a bad day.

But YES on the gas.

Slo

[SGT-MILLER]

Nope..no training issues. All rounds were COM (about an 12-14 inch grouping). Highest round was in the collar bone region, the lowest round was just above the belly button. Good luck trying to hit the head while the target is moving, that's a bad tactic.

In any case, I don't see this gun being popular in the states, it it marketed pretty well in Europe right now.

[Dillinger]

At this point I am about ready to ask what difference it makes if one guy, or one Superman for that matter, took several shots to be put down in relation to the thread at hand?

This constant reverting to one person, who may or may not have been shot 13 times and wasn't stopped, in relation to whether or not a gas gun could be applied in a standard, real world application is pretty damn pointless.

Given that example as the Mendoza Line - NOTHING YOU CARRY IS GOING TO BE ENOUGH!

First off, how many people are you encountering, who are on PCP, on a daily basis?

Then, how many of them are intent on doing you harm?

If you answered A LOT to either of those questions, you need to be considering a change of venue, not the purchase of a gas gun, or any other gun for that matter.

JD

[Southern6er]

My daughter carries the smaller version for her purse. My wife carries a Taser C2 with her. Both have their use and place.

I try to teach them situational awareness so that if somebody looks 'odd', you can take precautions to keep them out of range before they become a direct threat.

As mentioned, these types of setups DO have their uses. I have no issue with dealing with somebody threatening my family, my wife and daughter are a bit more hesitant on that front. I do NOT want them being unarmed on campus, so they have other options available to them. Neither is ideal, but they are a far cry better than being unarmed and unprepared.

Perhaps in time, I can get my wife comfortable with a handgun. But I'm not pushing that. I'm just trying to find a pistol that she'll feel comfortable shooting, just to get her in that door. Even if she DOES pick up shooting, being a student, she can't carry firearms on campus legally. The Taser and Kimber spray are both legal on campus.

[SGT-MILLER]

I'm wondering who sells them in the USA? I've never heard of the gas guns until I started the video and started this thread.

I would think this tool could be marketed really good in place like New York, and whatnot.

[Southern6er]

I've seen them for sale on places like Gunbroker. I've seen them in a few gun shops. I purchased mine from a family friend that runs a police outfitter (Ray O'Herron) out of Illinois.

The taser was purchased from a local gun shop as well, which is owned and operated by cops (both current and former).

[slowryde45]

Originally Posted by SGT-MILLER

Nope..no training issues. All rounds were COM (about an 12-14 inch grouping). Highest round was in the collar bone region, the lowest round was just above the belly button. Good luck trying to hit the head while the target is moving, that's a bad tactic.

In any case, I don't see this gun being popular in the states, it it marketed pretty well in Europe right now.

Only a bad tactic if you are trying that shot first. Usually...one to COM will suffice enough to slow the perp (depending on caliber), allowing a second shot to the head. If you miss that, then the one to the pelvic area will...again, USUALLY,...be enough to stop all forward progress, as it destroys the hip. And no, that isn't from the 'John Wayne' school of fancy shooting

But...I will say that we were 'trained' to shoot that way, only after quite extensive training under a variety of conditions, and with quite an assortment of firearms. For the majority of the population, shooting like your friend did was probably the best scenario, and one that is usually taught. That being, shoot COM until the threat ends, reload, reassess the situation, continue if necessary.

Again, the gas could diffuse the situation enough to not have to resort to deadly force.

Slo

Slo

[c3shooter]

A surprising number of states/ cities ban or restrict possession of "less than lethal" weapons- such as stun guns, OC spray, etc. NYPD carries Sabre (blend of pepper spray/ CS) but YOU can't own it in NY. Link to list:http://www.selfdefenseproductsflorida.com/StatesProhibit.html