Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > Gear & Accessories > Ammunition & Reloading > Mil-spec FMJ vs Civ FMJ and TMJ vs CMJ

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Old 05-26-2014, 01:33 PM   #11
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1st) Thanks for the clarifications on pulled bullets.........2nd) regarding TMJ being safer: well yeah, it is....BUT....I think that the danger from exposed (to burning gases) lead is SLIGHTLY over stated, and just another reason used by the anti-gun crowd to ban shooting or indoor ranges.
Whenever I melt/cast lead I do it outdoors, but I don't lose sleep if I shot some NON-tmj rounds indoors.
Simply, no studies exist that prove the benefit of shooting TMJ. Had there been any, CCI Speer would have likely made references to them on every box. On the other hand, common sense tells us, no harm in the TMJs for the same price as FMJ.

The common concern about lead poisoning is played up often to sell products. Truth in advertising does not require that they distinguish LEAD COMPOUNDS (toxic) from ELEMENTAL LEAD (largely inert), but doing so would be nice wouldn't it.
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Old 05-26-2014, 02:15 PM   #12
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Lead poses no health risk unless it is disolved into a liquified form via a chemical process and absorbed through the skin or ingested. If lead is gassified by heating it poses a health risk.

I prefer to shoot tmj bullets over exposed lead because its easier to clean the bore later. You don't have lead building up with copper. Tmj bullets tend to be more aerodynamic as well. Tmj have a greater chance of retaining the jacket on impact than lead based bullets do.

Lead smelters for casting don't get hot enough to gassify lead but there are other chemicals and fumes that come off fluxing lead you don't want to breathe.

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Old 05-26-2014, 02:31 PM   #13
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Actually the terms TMJ and CMJ are misnomers, They are not jacketed, they are thickly plated. It is not possible to COMPLETELY jacket a bullet. TMJ more concentric than plain FMJ.

And, the primer does not "release" the lead from the base of the bullet, the primer CONTAINS lead.

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Old 05-26-2014, 02:38 PM   #14
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That's more along the lines of what i was taking from past forums read; along with a possible wear to the case due to the dispelled lead that normally leaves the case flat.. That and from the hard contact of a TMJ it can lead to a quicker wear on either the barrel or the firing pin.. Any thoughts on either of those?
I do not know who told you this information, but WTH? Wear to the case? Dispelled lead? Hard contact of a TMJ? Hard contact to what? What is this going to wear? How does a firing pin get worn by a bullet?

If someone is actually telling you stuff like that, NEVER SPEAK TO THAT PERSON AGAIN!!! They should not be allowed anywhere near a firearm, ever!
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Old 05-26-2014, 02:43 PM   #15
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Actually the terms TMJ and CMJ are misnomers, They are not jacketed, they are thickly plated. It is not possible to COMPLETELY jacket a bullet. TMJ more concentric than plain FMJ.

And, the primer does not "release" the lead from the base of the bullet, the primer CONTAINS lead.
Yes, the primer contains lead. When the primer burns, it releases lead in your face. I referred to it as CCI's marketing. "Base of the bullet" was nowhere in the context.
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Old 05-26-2014, 04:14 PM   #16
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Default Mil-spec FMJ vs Civ FMJ and TMJ vs CMJ

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Originally Posted by robocop10mm View Post
I do not know who told you this information, but WTH? Wear to the case? Dispelled lead? Hard contact of a TMJ? Hard contact to what? What is this going to wear? How does a firing pin get worn by a bullet?

If someone is actually telling you stuff like that, NEVER SPEAK TO THAT PERSON AGAIN!!! They should not be allowed anywhere near a firearm, ever!
Again, these were all strange dead-ends on the great interweb that i have stumbled across; either information that didn't quite line up or information that couldn't be found at all.. That's why i'm asking you guys, the reliable ones, for setting the facts straight and better informing me!

Ps- i also have some questions regarding calibur comparison and reliable platforms/frames but i'm saving that for after this all gets resolved!! Any idea on CMJ's vs TMJ's? They look to be synonymous from the diagrams i'm seeing but, again, i'd rather hear it from one of you
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Old 05-26-2014, 04:50 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robocop10mm View Post
Actually the terms TMJ and CMJ are misnomers, They are not jacketed, they are thickly plated. It is not possible to COMPLETELY jacket a bullet. TMJ more concentric than plain FMJ.

And, the primer does not "release" the lead from the base of the bullet, the primer CONTAINS lead.
sierra and hornady produce total metal jacketed bullets or fmj using a copper jacket not plated. the jacket is swaged into a cup then ran through bullet dies to seal the core inside. its not as cheap or quick as a typical exposed base fmj but it is done for small game hunting for fur bearing animals where expansion and separation of core to jacket while maintaining extreme accuracy are desired.
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Old 05-26-2014, 05:08 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Secondhand_Hero View Post
Again, these were all strange dead-ends on the great interweb that i have stumbled across; either information that didn't quite line up or information that couldn't be found at all.. That's why i'm asking you guys, the reliable ones, for setting the facts straight and better informing me!

Ps- i also have some questions regarding calibur comparison and reliable platforms/frames but i'm saving that for after this all gets resolved!! Any idea on CMJ's vs TMJ's? They look to be synonymous from the diagrams i'm seeing but, again, i'd rather hear it from one of you
I can't rermember dealing with CMJ's (or did not pay attention to the corporate-speak) Care to remember who sells them?
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Old 05-26-2014, 05:13 PM   #19
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Default Mil-spec FMJ vs Civ FMJ and TMJ vs CMJ

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I can't rermember dealing with CMJ's (or did not pay attention to the corporate-speak) Care to remember who sells them?
It looks like 'Montana Gold' are the larger sellers but i'm seeing CapTech, Frontier, and a couple of others as well..

They are using the same 'lead-safe' statements as TMJ's but it maybe the two use different processes on the jackets themselves? i honestly can't tell..
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Old 05-26-2014, 05:43 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Secondhand_Hero View Post
It looks like 'Montana Gold' are the larger sellers but i'm seeing CapTech, Frontier, and a couple of others as well..

They are using the same 'lead-safe' statements as TMJ's but it maybe the two use different processes on the jackets themselves? i honestly can't tell..
No, haven't seen that ammo. Maybe different... but sure quacks like a duck
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