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Old 10-05-2011, 12:31 AM   #11
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"HAZMAT FEE" OK, in the past I worked for a big carrier and was a Dangerous Goods Specialist. Where I worked the specialist had to do computor training for about 5 hours then take a 40 hour in person traing class. Then they usually worked with another specialist for at least a week to get up to speed on the inspection process which includes the government mandated paperwork. Remember, they just don't inspect primers and powder. It covers all types of HAZ MAT even if they are not permitted to carry it! Then once a year the specialist has to take a refresher course on both the computor and in person. Intitially they have at least 60 plus hours on the training and 40 plus hours on the recurrent training. That's the traning end of it.

Now, some of your Dangerous Goods must be shiped in only approved containers with special attachments for air operations. Also the airplane must be equipped with the suppression equipment as well. Very costly to say the least.

Last, every step of the way the package is inspected by a Specialist and approved or rejected.

With all this said, I agree that $25 sounds like a lot of money to an induvidual. The question is, how much is someones life worth if the Dangerous Goods causes a crash or some other dissaster?

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Old 10-05-2011, 01:25 AM   #12
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"HAZMAT FEE" OK, in the past I worked for a big carrier and was a Dangerous Goods Specialist. Where I worked the specialist had to do computor training for about 5 hours then take a 40 hour in person traing class. Then they usually worked with another specialist for at least a week to get up to speed on the inspection process which includes the government mandated paperwork. Remember, they just don't inspect primers and powder. It covers all types of HAZ MAT even if they are not permitted to carry it! Then once a year the specialist has to take a refresher course on both the computor and in person. Intitially they have at least 60 plus hours on the training and 40 plus hours on the recurrent training. That's the traning end of it.

Now, some of your Dangerous Goods must be shiped in only approved containers with special attachments for air operations. Also the airplane must be equipped with the suppression equipment as well. Very costly to say the least.

Last, every step of the way the package is inspected by a Specialist and approved or rejected.

With all this said, I agree that $25 sounds like a lot of money to an induvidual. The question is, how much is someones life worth if the Dangerous Goods causes a crash or some other dissaster?

Mark

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Mark,Being a professional trucker,I know all about Haz-Mat.
Since 9/11 the laws have been really changed up.It's a real PIA to get a Haz-Mat endorsement on your CDL,and it's expensive also.
But what chaps my azz is this personal fee for powders/primers.These fees charged by UPS and FedEx are just like the baggage fees the airlines are charging,and should be illegal.
The drivers that haul the goods don't get paid anything extra.All the money goes 100% in the profit side of the carrier,for doing nothing other than delivering their normal freight.

Smokeless gunpowder and primers are at the very low end of the spectrum when it comes to hauling hazardous materials.
If the general public knew the truth about Haz-Mat,they would probably raise hell to these carriers for this bogus fee.

A 5 gallon can of paint thinner is more dangerous than a box with 4/8lb jugs of gunpowder,but you don't see Home Depot charging a $25 fee for that,do ya!
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Old 10-05-2011, 08:43 AM   #13
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hillbilly, everybody pays hazmat fees, even Lowes. they just tack it on to the price of the item. they buy in bulk so they offset the cost quite a lot. it seems like a lot when you only buy a few pounds of powder, because you are buying in small batches. if you bought a hundred pounds of powder, you probably wouldn't notice that $25 hazmat fee as much.
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Old 10-05-2011, 12:39 PM   #14
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hillbilly, I still have the haz endorcement on my license and it is expensive. Yes 911 changes a lot of things especially the endorsement process. TSA did a back ground clearence for me for an airport ID then a month later had to pay TSA to do it again for my endorsement on my license??? I feel it is too expensive for me not to keep the endorsement. Heck maybe someday I will need to haul 10,000 pouunds or ammo, powder, primers or even blueing and cleaning chemicals and I will be covered. I do agree with you on the fees. There is items that need to be seperated and transported differently and that is why the fee but the carriers have not or will not put a system in place to bill for them seperately. But the other stuff that rides with the regular cargo should not have the fee or even a lesser fee. The problem is as you know that if it is haz the driver has to have paperwork within arms reach while driving and stored in door pocket or on seat when not in vehicle and that paperwork needs to be filled out buy someone as to what is on/in the vehicle and where it is loaded wether it needs special handling or not so that emergency responders do not jet injured. If you can keep someone from getting injured or possibly killed no amount of money is too much. And yes the carrier keeps all the money. And NO the employee in most cases are not paid anymore for handling it or being a specialist.

Like I said before, $25 for an individual seems like alot but in the big picture for all the carriers have to go through to handle it, it is not so much. If you want to avoid paying the large one time fees you an order more at one time to offset the fee or you can indirectly pay it by buying it locally. We all know you pay for it one way or the other. I try to avoid it as much as possible. When ordering ammo I stay under the limit and have it shipped ground. If I am going to have to pay it I buy large enough quantities to try to offset it by having a couple of buddies go together on an order. I will even call customers and give them a discount on the overall price of the product if they throw in on the order.

You are going to pay it one way or the other. It is up to you on how much you are willing to spend towards it or how you are going to offset it.

Just my thoughts!

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Old 10-05-2011, 05:01 PM   #15
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No one has mentioned the cost to the carrier for carrying HAZMAT insurance on all of the vehicles that carry these goods. When you mention the carrier keeping all of the "profit," there are a few licenses, costs, inspections and headaches they have to pay for that causes them to charge the fee to offset the costs of carrying the goods.

I did not know that the drivers did not get paid anymore for that certification. That's like a specialty and I think the carrier should pay more for the expertise, at least while you are carrying a HAZMAT load! That is complete BS and seems like the carrier is taking advantage of the drivers.

Finally, this sounds like the exact thing a forum of like-minded people could get together and foil! Let's see, if I didn't want to suck up the whole HAZMAT fee myself, I might post a new topic: "SW Ohio reloader ordering powder/primer wants to share with locals on BIG order." Then in the body: "Anyone in Ohio, Indiana or Kentucky willing to drive to Cincinnati for pickup and share the HAZMAT fee and shipping charges can get in on an order for powder, primer and ammo! Your shipping based on weight but HAZMAT split equally among all. Hoping to go over half ton to get really good trucking rates! Call me at (513) 123-**** or pm me if interested and let me know what you wish to order. I will get you a quote. All orders must be prepaid as we get discount from my gun store supplier."

Anyone like this idea to save money? Might even get to know people to shoot and hunt with!
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Old 10-07-2011, 12:18 PM   #16
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No one has mentioned the cost to the carrier for carrying HAZMAT insurance on all of the vehicles that carry these goods. When you mention the carrier keeping all of the "profit," there are a few licenses, costs, inspections and headaches they have to pay for that causes them to charge the fee to offset the costs of carrying the goods.

I did not know that the drivers did not get paid anymore for that certification. That's like a specialty and I think the carrier should pay more for the expertise, at least while you are carrying a HAZMAT load! That is complete BS and seems like the carrier is taking advantage of the drivers.

Finally, this sounds like the exact thing a forum of like-minded people could get together and foil! Let's see, if I didn't want to suck up the whole HAZMAT fee myself, I might post a new topic: "SW Ohio reloader ordering powder/primer wants to share with locals on BIG order." Then in the body: "Anyone in Ohio, Indiana or Kentucky willing to drive to Cincinnati for pickup and share the HAZMAT fee and shipping charges can get in on an order for powder, primer and ammo! Your shipping based on weight but HAZMAT split equally among all. Hoping to go over half ton to get really good trucking rates! Call me at (513) 123-**** or pm me if interested and let me know what you wish to order. I will get you a quote. All orders must be prepaid as we get discount from my gun store supplier."

Anyone like this idea to save money? Might even get to know people to shoot and hunt with!
Sounds like a great plan, except i think there's a 90lb something max weight.
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Old 10-08-2011, 03:10 PM   #17
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I am thinking you can order palet size of anything and the haz fee will still be the same. The only hting is that you may not be able to purchase that much per BATF without an Explosive License.

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