Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > Gear & Accessories > Ammunition & Reloading > Hard Cast Bullets in a 7.62 Tokarev?

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-27-2013, 06:11 PM   #1
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Reno,Texas
Posts: 10,211
Liked 6557 Times on 3635 Posts
Likes Given: 27929

Default Hard Cast Bullets in a 7.62 Tokarev?

Is the 7.62 Tokarev too hot for hard cast lead? It's pretty common to get 1200-1600 FPS out of it.

I plan on shooting bullets in the 80-100 range since that's what I use for my Nagant. About how fast is too fast for lead?

__________________

Last edited by texaswoodworker; 12-27-2013 at 07:57 PM.
texaswoodworker is offline  
 
Reply With Quote

Join FirearmsTalk.com Today - It's Free!

Are you a firearms enthusiast? Then we hope you will join the community. You will gain access to post, create threads, private message, upload images, join groups and more.

Firearms Talk is owned and operated by fellow firearms enthusiasts. We strive to offer a non-commercial community to learn and share information.

Join FirearmsTalk.com Today! - Click Here


Old 12-27-2013, 07:44 PM   #2
Moderator
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
JonM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rochester WI,Rochester WI
Posts: 16,920
Liked 5116 Times on 2662 Posts
Likes Given: 310

Default

You might need gaschecks as your hitting some higher velocity on the top end.

I shoot that range of hardcast in my 45-70 with no leading but I use good lube in the lube rings. If the bullet your using doesn't have those rings your prolly going to need checks.

Fire a couple mags check for leading in the barrel. Looks like greyish silver streaks down the bore. Monitor closely for leading as your on the edge with that round even with hardcast

__________________

"Gun control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound." — L. Neil Smith

The problem with being stupid is you cannot simply decide to stop doing dumb things...

JonM is online now  
texaswoodworker Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 07:57 PM   #3
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Reno,Texas
Posts: 10,211
Liked 6557 Times on 3635 Posts
Likes Given: 27929

Default

How about something like these?

http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=184&category=5&secondary=20&key words=

http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=65&category=5&secondary=20&keyw ords=

The price is great, and they have the rings and lube (I'm guessing that's what the blue is). The only problem is that they are .313, and my bore is .309 between the bottoms of the gooves, so I'd have to re size the bullets to .311. That's an easy fix though.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/523184/lee-bullet-lube-and-size-kit-311-diameter

Also, if I was going to use jacketed bullets, what diameter would be best for that bore? .308? .309? .310?

__________________

Last edited by texaswoodworker; 12-27-2013 at 08:20 PM.
texaswoodworker is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 08:08 PM   #4
The Apocalypse Is Coming.....
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Axxe55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: East Texas, Texas!
Posts: 26,828
Liked 19550 Times on 11096 Posts
Likes Given: 49198

Default

subscribed! sounds interesting.

__________________
Coming from the Village of the Damned.
Resist all Tyranny and Oppression.
Axxe55 is offline  
2
People Like This 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 08:30 PM   #5
Moderator
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
JonM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rochester WI,Rochester WI
Posts: 16,920
Liked 5116 Times on 2662 Posts
Likes Given: 310

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by texaswoodworker View Post
How about something like these?

http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=184&category=5&secondary=20&key words=

http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=65&category=5&secondary=20&keyw ords=

The price is great, and they have the rings and lube (I'm guessing that's what the blue is). The only problem is that they are .313, and my bore is .309 between the bottoms of the gooves, so I'd have to re size the bullets to .311. That's an easy fix though.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/523184/lee-bullet-lube-and-size-kit-311-diameter

Also, if I was going to use jacketed bullets, what diameter would be best for that bore? .308? .309? .310?
The blue is lube those will likely work fine without leading if the bore is nice and bright. Always monitor for leading when trying new to the gun cast bullets.

As for diameter, .313 should be just fine as the range of bullets for a soviet .311 7.62 bore is .311-.313. You don't want a bullet same size or smaller than the bore or you get severe gas blowby which will decrease velocity and accuracy and possibly reliability in ftf fte and cause severe leading. Those shouldn't need sizing

Also with cast bullets you can use data for jacketed if no cast data exists just reduce loads by 20% but dont go below book minimum
__________________

"Gun control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound." — L. Neil Smith

The problem with being stupid is you cannot simply decide to stop doing dumb things...


Last edited by JonM; 12-27-2013 at 08:43 PM.
JonM is online now  
texaswoodworker Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2013, 01:47 AM   #6
Moderator
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
robocop10mm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Austin,Texas, by God!!
Posts: 9,888
Liked 2551 Times on 1339 Posts
Likes Given: 192

Default

Those Missouri bullets are too soft. They say "for Cowboy action velocities". That wouild be under 1000 fps.

You want a Linotype or 50/50 Lino/WW

__________________

In life, strive to take the high road....It offers a better field of fire.
"Robo is right" Fuzzball

robocop10mm is online now  
2
People Like This 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2013, 01:52 AM   #7
Moderator
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
JonM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rochester WI,Rochester WI
Posts: 16,920
Liked 5116 Times on 2662 Posts
Likes Given: 310

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robocop10mm View Post
Those Missouri bullets are too soft. They say "for Cowboy action velocities". That wouild be under 1000 fps.

You want a Linotype or 50/50 Lino/WW
good catch didnt see that
__________________

"Gun control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound." — L. Neil Smith

The problem with being stupid is you cannot simply decide to stop doing dumb things...

JonM is online now  
texaswoodworker Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2013, 02:43 AM   #8
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: The Edge of Darkness
Posts: 6,495
Liked 4787 Times on 2678 Posts
Likes Given: 1736

Default

I push straight Linotype bullets with gas checks over 1,600 fps in the HK roller block action-ed CZ-52 pistol. The 7.62 X 25 bullets should be sized to .308 diameter. Use a very hard lube. Bullet made for the 7.62 are .308 the Sierra 85 grs. and others are .308. You can go .309 but not necessary.

__________________
nitestalker is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2013, 02:57 AM   #9
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Reno,Texas
Posts: 10,211
Liked 6557 Times on 3635 Posts
Likes Given: 27929

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonM View Post
The blue is lube those will likely work fine without leading if the bore is nice and bright. Always monitor for leading when trying new to the gun cast bullets.

As for diameter, .313 should be just fine as the range of bullets for a soviet .311 7.62 bore is .311-.313. You don't want a bullet same size or smaller than the bore or you get severe gas blowby which will decrease velocity and accuracy and possibly reliability in ftf fte and cause severe leading. Those shouldn't need sizing

Also with cast bullets you can use data for jacketed if no cast data exists just reduce loads by 20% but dont go below book minimum
The bore in this one is .309. Would a .313 bullet still work fine, or is that too over sized?

Quote:
Originally Posted by robocop10mm View Post
Those Missouri bullets are too soft. They say "for Cowboy action velocities". That wouild be under 1000 fps.

You want a Linotype or 50/50 Lino/WW
Well, I've been wanting to get into casting my own anyways. I have a good bit of soft lead stored away (easily enough for several thousand bullets), so I just need to find some linotype to mix in now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nitestalker View Post
I push straight Linotype bullets with gas checks over 1,600 fps in the HK roller block action-ed CZ-52 pistol. The 7.62 X 25 bullets should be sized to .308 diameter. Use a very hard lube. Bullet made for the 7.62 are .308 the Sierra 85 grs. and others are .308. You can go .309 but not necessary.
I thought it was common practice to use lead bullets that were over-sized by .001"-.002" to increase accuracy
__________________
texaswoodworker is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2013, 03:04 AM   #10
Moderator
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
JonM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rochester WI,Rochester WI
Posts: 16,920
Liked 5116 Times on 2662 Posts
Likes Given: 310

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by texaswoodworker View Post
The bore in this one is .309. Would a .313 bullet still work fine, or is that too over sized?

Its not oversized. Bullets need to be bigger than the bore by a scootch or two so they keep the hot gas behind the bullet. Some guns will shoot good with same size but most don't. Depends on the gun.


Well, I've been wanting to get into casting my own anyways. I have a good bit of soft lead stored away (easily enough for several thousand bullets), so I just need to find some linotype to mix in now.

Your going to need a hardness tester. I use a lee one and its good enough

I thought it was common practice to use lead bullets that were over-sized by .001"-.002" to increase accuracy

See my reply above
Replies in bold.

Try various sized bullets from 308 to 313 see what works best before buying molds and bullet sizer. When you do you want a mold that is a little bigger or same as the sizer and the sizer the size you actually want
__________________

"Gun control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound." — L. Neil Smith

The problem with being stupid is you cannot simply decide to stop doing dumb things...


Last edited by JonM; 12-28-2013 at 03:09 AM.
JonM is online now  
texaswoodworker Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Firearms Forum Replies Last Post
shooting steel with hard cast bullets Ricochet Ammunition & Reloading 4 05-10-2013 02:05 AM
hard cast .44mag Ricochet Ammunition & Reloading 28 04-03-2013 11:41 AM
380 ACP Cast bullets JimsK9s Semi-Auto Handguns 0 03-05-2012 01:47 PM
Are Hard Cast Bullets Best J&S Custom Bullets Ammunition & Reloading 5 02-16-2010 08:34 AM
44 Mag hard cast loads rodwhaincamo Ammunition & Reloading 1 10-15-2009 01:37 PM