T Bladen & Son Double Hammer and Trigger English shotgun
Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > Long Guns > General Shotgun Discussion > T Bladen & Son Double Hammer and Trigger English shotgun

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-25-2010, 09:15 PM   #1
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: STUCK IN NJ
Posts: 4
Default T Bladen & Son Double Hammer and Trigger English shotgun

I was given an old Double Barrel, Double Hammer & Trigger British shotgun made by "T BLADEN & SON". It has no numbers, but on the strap between the barrels it says "LONDON FINE DAMASCUS"..
I am seeking any information on this old Shotgun.
It is in good shape despite the overall rust on the barrel, but I don't want to re-finish it without some idea of its age & value as it would change the original finish..
Any info would be greatly appreciated, Thanks..
DOCSMOKEY

__________________
DOCSMOKEY is offline  
 
Reply With Quote

Join FirearmsTalk.com Today - It's Free!

Are you a firearms enthusiast? Then we hope you will join the community. You will gain access to post, create threads, private message, upload images, join groups and more.

Firearms Talk is owned and operated by fellow firearms enthusiasts. We strive to offer a non-commercial community to learn and share information.

Join FirearmsTalk.com Today! - Click Here


Old 09-26-2010, 08:11 PM   #2
Moderator
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
c3shooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Third bunker on the right,Central Virginia
Posts: 16,718
Liked 8883 Times on 3846 Posts
Likes Given: 1391

Default

Being marked LONDON FINE DAMASCUS does not mean made in England. Some guns were marked as such as advertising hype. Remove the forearm, and on the water table you should find proofs, choke marks, etc ad infinitum.

Re: Shooting- damascus was made for black powder. SOME better quality guns may be shot with low pressure loads IF the barrels have not got corrosion spots- THAT needs a competent smith that is equipped for some testing. If it was a Parker, a Purdey, a Holland & Holland- maybe. Me- I would not. I'm a big chicken. Plan to be the oldest damn chicken in the coop, too.

Re: Cleanup- Go find a product called KROIL. Wet surfaces, drape with cotton or burplap wetted with Kroil, let set overnight. Rub with hand power and clean cloth, changing spots as needed- the rust you are taking off IS abrasive itself. No sandpaper, no dremels. For BAD rust, get a Chore Boy COPPER pot scrubber, wet with oil, go lightly.

__________________

What we have here is... failure- to communicate.

c3shooter is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2010, 09:47 PM   #3
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: STUCK IN NJ
Posts: 4
Default T Bladen & Son Double Hammer and Trigger English shotgun=REPLY

To C3Shooter;
Hey thanks for the cleanup info, It'll make my work a little easier..
The marks under the forarm guard look like a "C" followed by what looks like Wheat Stalks and then the letter "B" followed by small crossed swords.. The marks on the receiver housing under the firing pins look like (all together as one magk) a Crown, Verticle stripped shield with crossed (either) hammer/sword or two swords..
See Attached Photo's..
Again, Thanks for your info
Docsmokey

dsci1786.jpg   dsc00003.jpg   dsci1793.jpg   dsci1809.jpg  
__________________
DOCSMOKEY is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2010, 12:33 AM   #4
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Louisville,Kentucky
Posts: 1
Default Thos Bladen and Sons

I have a shotgun identical to yours that I have been trying to identify. It definitely says Bladen, not Bland. Except for your posting, I have not found any other reference to this manufacturer. This was my Grandfathers shotgun, purchased in the Louisville, KY or southern Indiana. Did you ever learn any more about the manufacturer?

__________________
dfeiock124 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2010, 01:18 AM   #5
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Hawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Heidelberg,MS
Posts: 1,405
Liked 77 Times on 52 Posts
Likes Given: 28

Default

It has Birmingham proof marks on it. T. Bladen & Son is most likely the name of the hardware store that sold it. Probably made in the late 1880's-1900 or therabouts

__________________
Hawg is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2010, 01:29 AM   #6
Moderator
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
JonM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rochester WI,Rochester WI
Posts: 17,597
Liked 5686 Times on 2971 Posts
Likes Given: 377

Default

the maker is a gun co. in birmingham england T bladen and son. made in the late 1800's early 1900's as a low end export hunting arm for the american consumer. you will have to consult a proofmark books to determine what the 13b 14m choke mark means.

one other thing they didnt have model names back then most companies in england didnt even list years the weapon was invented. they just sold as your shotgun would be called maybe "bladen double" most english companies only made one or two models and that was it. it wasnt like colt and winchester in the states cranking out numerous different types.

__________________

"Gun control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound." — L. Neil Smith

The problem with being stupid is you cannot simply decide to stop doing dumb things...


Last edited by JonM; 12-25-2010 at 01:38 AM.
JonM is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2010, 04:56 AM   #7
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: STUCK IN NJ
Posts: 4
Default

Dfeiock, From the Info I received from Mr W.S. (Bill) Curtis, Assistant Curator, Museum of the National Rifle Association, his info is as follows;
Very straight forward. This is a Birmingham gun made in one of the large factories established there who manufactured for the Trade and for Export. The gun carries the proof marks laid down under the Proof Acts for the Birmingham Proof House under the Rules in force between 1875 and 1887. These marks have been overstruck by other numbers at a later date for reasons I cannot explain and by other persons probably in the Americas who may have been associated with the local gun trade. I suggest that the name on the lock plates is most likely that of an American retail gun shop. It was common practice for retailers in the US and Canada to place orders through agents to importers who passed the orders to factories in Birmingham or Liege in Belgium. The factories would put any name they were asked for on the orders.

This gun was and maybe still is a sound working gun, almost certainly with damascus barrels, probably safe to use with black powder cartridges, but it must be emphasised that it is by no means a 'Best' or even medium grade gun by the standards of its day. Even if in immaculate or nearly new condition it would still be only of relatively low value. These were the workhorse, meat on the table guns for settlers and colonists and were priced accordingly. Fine pieces if they are retained with their provenance as items of family history but of very low commercial value.

Glad to have been of assistance,

Sincerely,

Bill Curtis

W. S. Curtis, A.C.I.I.,
Vice President (Hon.), Crimean War Research Society,
HBSA (Hon. Life),
Assistant Curator, Museum of the National Rifle Association,
Whitworth Rifle Research Project,
MLAGB, NLRC, ATRA, &c.
p.s.;
There is something I ought to add to my explanation in order to give you more understanding of the marks. During the period when these marks were used, choke boring was coming into widespread use and the authorities had been having some problems defining it. In 1875 the Rules changed and they first started to define the choke by putting two gauge sizes in the marks, e.g. 12B 13M which meant a 12 gauge tube at the Breech end with a 13 gauge Muzzle and the added words CHOKE. They also made tighter chokes marked 12B 14M and these used the words NOT FOR BALL for obvious reasons. The Rules changed in 1887 and again in 1896, 1904, 1925, 1954, 1989 and lastly 2005. It has to be remembered that in the USA there are no legal proof laws but all guns made in the UK must be proofed by law even if only intended for export. Similar laws apply to most of the countries of Europe. In Britain, the first such law came in during the 1640s. All American made guns imported into Britain have to be subjected to Proof at London or Birmingham and stamped accordingly before they can be sold or transferred to anyone other than a Registered Firearms Dealer
AND
Docsmokey has now sent me clear photos of this gun which is a typical top lever double hammer gun of Birmingham make carrying the proofmarks of the Birmingham Proof House under the Rules for 1875 to 1887. It has all the indications of a typical low end sound export gun for the American market. The locks are marked with the name of what I suspect are the retailers in America although they may well have been applied by the factory at the time of making in response to the order placed by the shipping agent on behalf of the New York importing agent.
I hope that this info that he sent to me also helps you & others with this gun!!
Clean it & hang it above the fireplace to look at!!
DOCSMOKEY

__________________

Last edited by DOCSMOKEY; 12-26-2010 at 04:59 AM.
DOCSMOKEY is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Firearms Forum Replies Last Post
Antique english double barrel markings? broknax General Shotgun Discussion 1 04-25-2010 10:26 AM
Which was invented first? The Double Barrel Shotgun or the Double Barrel Rifle? MP1000 General Shotgun Discussion 6 11-09-2009 09:16 PM
want to buy small bore hammer double barrel shotgun bob713hunt Curio & Relic Discussion 0 08-22-2009 02:19 PM
Parker Double Hammer Lifter (leaf springs) danthegunman General Shotgun Discussion 2 05-24-2008 02:06 AM