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-   -   ID assistance, please (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f26/id-assistance-please-54702/)

wjnfirearms 01-03-2012 06:44 PM

ID assistance, please
 
I have this 12 gauge side by side that a personal friend asked me to sell for him. The problem is that I cannot identify the manufacturer. On the sides of the gun , it's stamped MONTE CARLO and IMPORT. There are no other markings, proofs, etc. on the exterior. After breaking it down, I found the serial # and these.

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...r/IMG_2035.jpg
http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...r/IMG_2033.jpg

This is about the clearest I can get the pictures with my 8mp digital SLR and no macro lens.

Out of picture, are shield shaped proofs with I in the center. These sit closer to each barrel and were out of focus in the other pic I took. The diamonds at the bottom of each barrel have 12/30 in them.

The gun is blued and with a good quality wood stock. It does not look new at all. The serial # is just a 5 numerical number, no letters. It does resemble a Stoeger, but I cannot be sure. I'm suspecting either a smaller Italian, Spanish, or Belgium manufacturer. I would also doubt that this shotgun is worth a lot, either.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. It's in very nice condition overall and I'd like to get it listed for my friend as he could really use the cash. I've already consulted with a couple of other dealers, one local and one in Charlotte I network with and they were stymied also.

Sniper03 01-03-2012 10:33 PM

wjn,

We are going to need a photo shot of that Shield you mentioned or a good drawing of it to assist. You did a great job on the pics you sent. If you are getting glare of the shield which happens as you probably know. If it is on a radiused surface I sometimes put a piece of white paper over the flash and get close for the shot. There were so many shotguns made during the last part of the 1800s and begining of the 1900s both in the USA and England that without seeing the actual proof mark we are seemingly at a dead end. I did some research on the Diamond design pictured but am sure that is possible armorer's markings which may be difficult to track. We will be glad to help you try to find the manufacturer and date. I know you have but sometimes the manufacturers name was down the center of the rib between the barrels or on the bottom down the center and many times very hard to see due to age!
Let us know!:)

03

JonM 01-04-2012 02:58 AM

12/30 means 12ga 30" barrel. in the second pic the stamping "Smokeless Powder" is using a more modern font and appears machine stamped. pre-turn of the century and early 1900's stamping was done by a guy holding a hammer and punch each character was done individually. thats why up till the 40's serial numbers seldom lined up correctly or was hardly ever in exactly the same spot from sample to sample.

wjnfirearms 01-04-2012 09:39 PM

Thank you, guys. Here is the best pic I could do. The shields are in the upper portion of the photo on both sides on the edge of the flats.

http://http://i187.photobucket.com/a...r/IMG_2037.jpg

I might have a buyer for him, so it's now become a time sensitive issue as well.

Thanks, again.

Sniper03 01-05-2012 01:48 AM

wjn,

Sorry but the last picture did not come through!

03

wjnfirearms 01-05-2012 06:34 PM

I see that. Hmmm. Let's try this again.

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...r/IMG_2037.jpg

Aside the numbers, it says "NO BULLET".

FaTmAn 01-05-2012 08:24 PM

a pic of the whole gun to might help


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