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Old 03-11-2014, 02:46 AM   #31
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i have to disagree Jim. at very close range, even birdshot is deadly. i have tested myself #4 birdshot at 10 yards. it can and will penetrate 1/2" plywood, a quarter panel on a car, even a windshield of a car. how much more penetration is needed? is a human being, even with heavy clothing more immune to the effects of #4 birdshot at the realistic distances that would be used within the home? somehow i doubt it. but for many to say that only buckshot is effective for SD/HD use, IMO is nothing more than a myth or misconception that i have found to be simply not to be true.

funny thing is, and i have spoken to others, including my father who uses #4 birdshot in his shotgun for SD purposes, is they have said ask someone who believes that birdshot isn't effective, to volunteer to be a testing dummy. funny, so far, not one person will volunteer, but they still contend that it's not effective. hmmmmmm..........

here's a couple of videos testing birdshot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrM5U2kGQCc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wCnKo6-NKQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gGCedWUkk8
Disagree all you want, but you can't change science! My test dummies were in ER's and morgues!
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Old 03-11-2014, 02:57 AM   #32
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Disagree all you want, but you can't change science! My test dummies were in ER's and morgues!
i'm sorry, but i refuse to argue about it with you. i know for a fact what results i have gotten, and whether you, or anyone else wishes to believe it or not, frankly i really don't care. i am quite confident in my choices and i don't need your's or anyone else's approval or permission to use what i do.

have a good night sir..
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Old 03-11-2014, 03:21 AM   #33
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Axxe55, thanks for the help on the Weatherby. I am not sure why you guys are getting relied up over what to use. You all are talking about 10 yards, hell it will be 10 feet distance for home defense. The largest room in my house is the living room and it's only 20 by 15. I know things are larger in Texas, but come on how far is that bad guy going to be from the muzzle when the gun goes off.(5 - 6 feet maybe?)

About three years ago I was out in the woods patterned my Mossberg 835 turkey gun, the target was set up on a 4 inch sapling and after a few 2 3/4 inch #8's I switched to a 3 inch mag #4 turkey round, well to my surprise it cut that tree in half at 20 feet.

Like you, I use 00 buckshot or slugs in the HD gun. (just feel better about the reliability of them). but whatever Bob ends up with, I am sure it will do the job at SD distances indoors.

Stay safe and shoot straight.
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Old 03-11-2014, 03:31 AM   #34
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Axxe55, thanks for the help on the Weatherby. I am not sure why you guys are getting relied up over what to use. You all are talking about 10 yards, hell it will be 10 feet distance for home defense. The largest room in my house is the living room and it's only 20 by 15. I know things are larger in Texas, but come on how far is that bad guy going to be from the muzzle when the gun goes off.(5 - 6 feet maybe?)

About three years ago I was out in the woods patterned my Mossberg 835 turkey gun, the target was set up on a 4 inch sapling and after a few 2 3/4 inch #8's I switched to a 3 inch mag #4 turkey round, well to my surprise it cut that tree in half at 20 feet.

Like you, I use 00 buckshot or slugs in the HD gun. (just feel better about the reliability of them). but whatever Bob ends up with, I am sure it will do the job at SD distances indoors.

Stay safe and shoot straight.
Jim
my loads in my SD shotgun are five rounds of #4 birdshot in the tube and five rounds of OO buckshot on the butt carrier.

the longest shot within my home would be about 20 feet or less. i tested at 10 yards to push the load a bit to see what it would do. so at 15-20 feet, i have no doubt of the damage it will inflict.

i have heard the argument before, what if the BG has heavy clothing or a bulletproof vest? surely we wouldn't preach for someone carrying a pistol to rely upon one shot to put down a threat, so why would someone assume that i would just leave it at one shot with a shotgun? bulletproof vest? well if Mr. Bg happens to have one on, i seriously doubt buckshot is going to be anymore effective center mass that birdshot is. if i hit Mr. BG center mass, and he is still moving forward, then common sense says i need to aim either higher or lower and remove his motivation.
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Old 03-11-2014, 07:16 PM   #35
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...i am quite confident in my choices and i don't need your's or anyone else's approval or permission to use what i do.
Don't need approval SO FAR; Bloomers is working on that, I'm sure.

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Old 03-11-2014, 11:30 PM   #36
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i'm sorry, but i refuse to argue about it with you. i know for a fact what results i have gotten, and whether you, or anyone else wishes to believe it or not, frankly i really don't care. i am quite confident in my choices and i don't need your's or anyone else's approval or permission to use what i do.

have a good night sir..
Good, because I was not arguing, just stating fact I have learned in my research and testing.
I agree that it not my problem if anyone wish to disregard my advise. They will have to live with their decisions.
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Old 03-12-2014, 12:26 AM   #37
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Good, because I was not arguing, just stating fact I have learned in my research and testing.

I agree that it not my problem if anyone wish to disregard my advise. They will have to live with their decisions.

Or DIE if they selected wrong. I like 00 Buck for CQB or HP slugs. Would love to find the Hornady Critical Defense round in 12Ga.


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Old 03-12-2014, 01:25 AM   #38
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Wow, has this thread escalated. Although most of the points here are good points cruising through various scenarios...the OP just wanted something for home defense. I'm pretty sure he's not "chasing" gang members or cartells, not breeching doors, not rounding up bank robbers or engaging in firefights from moving vehicles. Now I understand that many here are new, many are well versed and many are LEO's with experience and that your scenarios make perfect sense to you. But let's face it, the guy breaking into your house one summer night is most likely NOT going to be wearing any body armor of any sort.
A good amount of firepower is great, but nothing is as effective as well placed shots. A homeowner, defending his property, family and life is obligated to never become the agressor in the sitation....so the need for any long range firepower is questionable. As far as the OP goes, he needs to start SOMEWHERE and I hope that some of the ideas and suggestions haven't confused him more than helped him. As he become more proficient with his choice he can surely decide where to go from there. All things considered...you really can't go wrong with a simple pump shotgun with a box of shells.....and just about any shells will make the point very clear that you plan on defending your "stuff"...whatever that may be. .......just sayin'
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Old 03-12-2014, 04:16 AM   #39
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Wouldn't recommend these for HD/SD, but... still pretty cool!
1394597516600.jpg   1394597529826.jpg   1394597540434.jpg  
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Old 03-12-2014, 05:20 AM   #40
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Wow,...just Wow...


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