Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > Long Guns > Auto & Semi-Auto Discussion > Why isn't a 7.62x39 AR the Perfect Rifle?

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Old 09-11-2009, 02:32 AM   #1
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Default Why isn't a 7.62x39 AR the Perfect Rifle?

After 47 years of owning nothing more than a Daisy BB gun as a kid, this year I bought a Mossy 500 and an XD-45. I am now scoping out (pardon the pun) rifles. I tried a friend's FAL (7.62 x 51), and it was so brutal that it was just unpleasant to shoot IMHO. On the other hand I love the look of the AR-15, but their 5.56 rounds seemed like popguns in comparison to the mighty 7.62x51 cartidges' sound! So I am thinking a 7.62 x 39 would be perfect, but then I read that the AK suffers from accuracy issues.

So while browsing Able Ammo's site I came across what seemed like the perfect hyrbrid: a 7.62 x 39 AR rifle!! 7.62 x 39 (or larger) is also recommended by Boston T. Party in his book "Boston's Gun Bible" if you are going to have just one rifle, which is probably my case for awhile due to money issues.

Please tell my why I shouldn't jump on a 7.62 x 39 AR. Thanks!

My purpose: Prepare for the revolt, target practice fun. Nothing much else.

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Old 09-11-2009, 02:52 AM   #2
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If you do some looking around there are so many calibers in AR's out now. There's the 6.8 Remington SPC that I've been hearing good things about, 7.62x39, 7.62x51(which is must more controllable in an AR than in a FAL), theres some really big .45 caliber stuff, .50 caliber stuff, and the new one that remingtons coming out with that's supposed to be the greatest thing since sliced bread, the .30 AR. The good thing about the 7.62x39 however, is not on the stopping power, but the price as well. It's still gonna be one of the cheaper ones out there.

-Fred

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Old 09-11-2009, 05:39 AM   #3
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For a long time, they had serious reliability issues with the magazines, due to piss poor engineering.

And the AK does not suffer from any accuracy issue beyond the user not knowing how to shoot...

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Old 09-11-2009, 05:40 AM   #4
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I can't argue with what you're saying...the world has seen numerous showdowns between the AK with its round and the M16/M4/AR and its round. Both have won because both do some things well and others not so much. I feel like ballistically, both rounds are a compromise...but then you never get anything for nothing.

I think most people who purchase a rifle for the civilian market have the luxury of selecting the ideal round for their particular needs and their particular circumstances. Bottom line is that if the 7.62x39 is the ideal round for you, and you prefer the AR platform, go for it. Simple as that. If I were looking for a round with reasonable recoil and purchasing an AR rifle wrapped around it, I'd heavily consider the 6.5 or 6.8, but then a Panther in .308 arouses me at this particular moment in time.

My question then becomes, how far out are you planning on engaging targets and/or zombies? If it's further out than say 100 meters or so, I'd check out some other rounds. If it's 100 meters or under, I think the 7.62.x39 is a fine round that will do just fine for you. Just my opinions.

Have a great night!

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Old 09-11-2009, 09:24 PM   #5
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7.62x39 is arguably underpowered. If you want a bullet that size, go big or stay home.

Also, the AR-15 platform is ubiquitous. Lots of parts, lots of people who own 'em. I can't see being the black sheep...it's a completely different rifle even though it looks similar.

If you want an AK, get one -- they're reliable as hell and are fine inside 100-150 yards.

Incidentally, have you looked at ballistics tests comparing the 7.62x39 and 5.56x45? If memory serves, it is extremely bad news to be on the receiving end of a 5.56 soft-tip: the ballistics reports are as good as or better than the 7.62x39. NATO required the 5.56 FMJ because anything else was "too lethal".

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Old 09-11-2009, 09:42 PM   #6
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THANKS for all of the tips/ideas. One other factor which I failed to emphasize is I don't have a lot of money, so cost of the ammo will be a big factor. If the 7.62x39 costs a lot more than a .223 (is that the right one? I know it's 5.56, sorry I am so ignorant on this stuff), then that swings my decision back to a 5.56 AR.

AUUUGH! Meanwhile I keep hearing about legislation coming our way in which any such rifles (semi-auto, w/magazines) will be confiscated and/or taxed to death (see lack of money issue above). I guess a 7.62 would be banned before a 5.56 would....I loathe our current govt officials. All of 'em. Sheez it's so hard to NOT talk politics when you're talking about guns at all anymore...

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Old 09-11-2009, 09:47 PM   #7
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Here's the deal. The 7.62 x 39 round is great - if you are shooting across the street. It hits hard, and it hits with the poop to put someone on their butt.

Now, go out to 200 or 300 yards, and you have a round that ballistically, just inferior to many other options out there.

The AK platform is great, for what it was designed to do. It was designed to be very easily maintained, run in all conditions, and shoot from here to there, on automatic fire, reliably. Mission accomplished.

The problem with all weapons that are op-od driven, which the AK is, is that the recoil forces extra tension on the receiver and accuracy suffers.

The AR platform is a gas powered weapon that doesn't suffer the same problems, so it is "more complicated" but also "more accurate".

Trying to marry the heavy, shorter round of the AK into the AR platform, in my mind, is a bit of a bastardized version of both that doesn't live up to the ultimate potential of either.

The 5.56mm round, coupled with a well built AR, and equipped with hollowpoint or soft point ammunition, is very lethal...

However, I would still prefer to have an AR-10, chambered in 7.62x51 because that round will reach out to 600 yards and still have the terminal ballistics to put a guys face in the dirt.

Properly tuned, several 7.62 x 51mm platform can be tamed and very easy to shoot.

I wouldn't put a stock FN FAL in that category.

JD

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Old 09-11-2009, 10:21 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
Here's the deal. The 7.62 x 39 round is great - if you are shooting across the street. It hits hard, and it hits with the poop to put someone on their butt.

Now, go out to 200 or 300 yards, and you have a round that ballistically, just inferior to many other options out there.

The AK platform is great, for what it was designed to do. It was designed to be very easily maintained, run in all conditions, and shoot from here to there, on automatic fire, reliably. Mission accomplished.

The problem with all weapons that are op-od driven, which the AK is, is that the recoil forces extra tension on the receiver and accuracy suffers.

The AR platform is a gas powered weapon that doesn't suffer the same problems, so it is "more complicated" but also "more accurate".

Trying to marry the heavy, shorter round of the AK into the AR platform, in my mind, is a bit of a bastardized version of both that doesn't live up to the ultimate potential of either.

The 5.56mm round, coupled with a well built AR, and equipped with hollowpoint or soft point ammunition, is very lethal...

However, I would still prefer to have an AR-10, chambered in 7.62x51 because that round will reach out to 600 yards and still have the terminal ballistics to put a guys face in the dirt.

Properly tuned, several 7.62 x 51mm platform can be tamed and very easy to shoot.

I wouldn't put a stock FN FAL in that category.

JD
As always, you are the voice of reason and I appreciate your well-written thought on the topic. Just what I was looking for.

NOW - one last Q: I want to be able to afford building up some proficiency with this thing. How expensive is 7.62 x 51 ammo relative to the 5.56/.223? Seems to me it'd be a lot more expensive than .223, which I found recently @ 50 for $9.49...
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Old 09-11-2009, 10:43 PM   #9
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7.62 x 51 is definitely going to cost you more. No fancy way around it.

The 5.56mm platform is a great way to start, especially because you can get a .22lr conversion and you can shoot all day long for just a couple of $10'ers.

A 7.62 x 51mm AR-10 would suit you well in the End of Days, but I would not recommend that as your "first" step into the AR platform.

The problem I have with the AK platform is that should End of Days happen, and it NOT involve the Chinese Red Army, the ammo is going to dry up pretty damn quick.

5.56mm and .308/7.62 on the other hand, well......

Every police station, National Guard Armory, sporting goods store, etc is going to have some sort of "stock".

And that doesn't even include all the "battlefield" pick ups....

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Old 09-11-2009, 10:59 PM   #10
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.......of course if you're looking for that instant one shot stopper.......



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