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Old 07-08-2012, 03:22 PM   #21
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Here we have the same "problem" with bow hunters, they feel they are the only ones who are the true hunter because those of us who feel the need to use any sort of firearm are not "real" hunters, bow hunting is so much more challenge and sport as they claim, and there are a lot of them and every time they cry foul they get their way, I like bow hunting but I have always love gun hunting. Personally I don't agree with your opinion on inlines being unfair to traditionalists and if I had the experience you describe of stalking a buck and someone sniping it out from under me from 200 yds out I would say the problem is hunting in an area overpopulated by hunters, the same scenario could possibly happen with another hunter with a traditional shooting from 70 yds away I'd think. I think hunters being against other hunters due to the game or method they like is bad enough, but I think a Muzzleloading Assoc. working against muzzleloading hunters who choose a different more modern style gun is downright deplorable. Imagine if the Bowhunting Assoc. told us we had to throw away our Mathews and Hoyt bows in favor of long bow only, oh ya and all hunting must be done by stalking, there will be no tree stands allowed because that isn't traditional either.
EXACTLY!!! See my post above! We just got crossbows as legal archery equipment and the "traditionalist" bowhunters went ape ****. MANY a great debate was had (on my part) Boy they didnt like it when i dogged 'em out about their "traditional" Mathews with fiber optic pins, 75% let off, carbon fiber arrows, mechanical broadheads etc...then they really squealed when i pointed out the historical FACT that crossbows predated the long bow by centuries! Then asked what would be more "TRADITIONAL"? By their "logic" i guess we would need to get rid of longbows, recurves, and compound bows altogether and just use crossbows.
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Old 07-08-2012, 03:24 PM   #22
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I am brand new to hunting, and one of my main concerns is a having a "clean kill". For this reason, I prefer to use a modern BP rifle. Just to improve my accuracy and success rate. I am leaning towards SS inline type rifle. The other reason is that deer rifle season is very limited in MD, so I was thinking that I just get ONE hunting rifle instead of a centerfire + a BP. Just use the BP for all seasons. Again, I am just getting into hunting so I don't know what the hell I am talking about!! I went deer hunting last year with a borrowed .270 but did not get a shot. I'd like to get my own gear.
If you like the one rifle idea, maybe look into the Thompson Encore or CVA Apex, these would give you a muzzleloader and for an extra couple hundred bucks you could buy a rifle barrel and have a single shot centerfire rifle in the same gun.
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Old 07-08-2012, 03:35 PM   #23
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EXACTLY!!! See my post above! We just got crossbows as legal archery equipment and the "traditionalist" bowhunters went ape ****. MANY a great debate was had (on my part) Boy they didnt like it when i dogged 'em out about their "traditional" Mathews with fiber optic pins, 75% let off, carbon fiber arrows, mechanical broadheads etc...then they really squealed when i pointed out the historical FACT that crossbows predated the long bow by centuries! Then asked what would be more "TRADITIONAL"? By their "logic" i guess we would need to get rid of longbows, recurves, and compound bows altogether and just use crossbows.
Ya, I cannot believe they throw such a fit over that stuff, it certainly doesn't mean there will be less deer if they allow crossbows, if they are concerned about the deer population then they also are probably hunting in a area overpopulated by hunters or just a plain bad spot, if anything I believe crossbows would be better for providing a clean kill as they are more like shooting a gun, I would say easier to shoot accurately more consistently, one thing that irritates me about bow hunters is the amount of game they lose around here, there's always guys at a local tavern in the fall talking about wounding one and not finding it, sometimes the same guy wounding many before finally killing one and finding it, we have shot many deer at gun season with arrows sticking out of them or with arrow heads lodged in their carcass and a big puss sack around it. That really irritates me.
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Old 07-08-2012, 03:41 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by winch View Post
I am brand new to hunting, and one of my main concerns is a having a "clean kill". For this reason, I prefer to use a modern BP rifle. Just to improve my accuracy and success rate. I am leaning towards SS inline type rifle. The other reason is that deer rifle season is very limited in MD, so I was thinking that I just get ONE hunting rifle instead of a centerfire + a BP. Just use the BP for all seasons. Again, I am just getting into hunting so I don't know what the hell I am talking about!! I went deer hunting last year with a borrowed .270 but did not get a shot. I'd like to get my own gear.
Winch, my friend, sorry about all the BS

IMHO i would steer you towards the CVA Wolf. Inexpensive (i use it for both modern firearm and muzzle loading seasons) Its easy to load, easy to clean. Just break it open, pop out the breech plug and run your patch down the bore till sparkling clean.

Most importantly, its DEADLY accurate! Not to mention DEVASTATING to whitetails!

45 yards, dropped in her tracks...


45 yards thru this timber...


she didnt give me much to shoot at, but i was confident enough in the Wolf to take the shot!

Lunch "shot"...
venison chili


Supper "shot"...

68 yards...confirmed w/ range finder after the shot....again, dropped in her tracks. neck shots will do that


what came out of her neck

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Old 07-08-2012, 03:45 PM   #25
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Ya, I cannot believe they throw such a fit over that stuff, it certainly doesn't mean there will be less deer if they allow crossbows, if they are concerned about the deer population then they also are probably hunting in a area overpopulated by hunters or just a plain bad spot, if anything I believe crossbows would be better for providing a clean kill as they are more like shooting a gun, I would say easier to shoot accurately more consistently, one thing that irritates me about bow hunters is the amount of game they lose around here, there's always guys at a local tavern in the fall talking about wounding one and not finding it, sometimes the same guy wounding many before finally killing one and finding it, we have shot many deer at gun season with arrows sticking out of them or with arrow heads lodged in their carcass and a big puss sack around it. That really irritates me.
Agreed!!

But i cant say much....i have wounded a couple and never found them with my archery equipment....doent mean i LIKE it....i actually had nightmares after those shots. But it does happen, no matter how skilled or how much practice one does.

As hunters we should be unified in using whatever equipment affords the best chance at a clean ETHICAL harvest!
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Old 07-08-2012, 03:48 PM   #26
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I have a small pasture, about 40 Acres that has a creek through one end. Last year, I was going to hunt it, because some big bucks hang out there. I didnt get to hunt the first day but I went up that evening and thought, I'd clear me a shooting lane and come back the next night with my Hawken. I took the chainsaw to a couple of trees to give me a clear path, and here comes about 5 guys, hauling out of the creek timber. WHAT are you doing, the first one yells at me. You ruined my hunting. I said, just who are you and why are you trespassing on my land? They had 5 tree stands put up there, because some guy in the oilfield had told them that big bucks hang out there and nobody hunts it....That I owned it, didnt matter to them. They left, and I did not report them. There is plenty of public hunting not far away, and they were directed to it.

That is the kind of thing that divides the hunters. That is the thing that sours me personally. I will be more vigilant this year, so watch the classifieds, as I may have some tree stands for sale.

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Old 07-08-2012, 03:59 PM   #27
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I have a small pasture, about 40 Acres that has a creek through one end. Last year, I was going to hunt it, because some big bucks hang out there. I didnt get to hunt the first day but I went up that evening and thought, I'd clear me a shooting lane and come back the next night with my Hawken. I took the chainsaw to a couple of trees to give me a clear path, and here comes about 5 guys, hauling out of the creek timber. WHAT are you doing, the first one yells at me. You ruined my hunting. I said, just who are you and why are you trespassing on my land? They had 5 tree stands put up there, because some guy in the oilfield had told them that big bucks hang out there and nobody hunts it....That I owned it, didnt matter to them. They left, and I did not report them. There is plenty of public hunting not far away, and they were directed to it.

That is the kind of thing that divides the hunters. That is the thing that sours me personally. I will be more vigilant this year, so watch the classifieds, as I may have some tree stands for sale.
Not much good to say about trespassers. Something i do my best to avoid.

But its a double edged sword. No one, these days, allows hunting on private property. ( i know because i have knocked on literally THOUSANDS of doors asking permission) This leads to people hunting where they can. When i was a kid, i could knock a door or two and have permission. NOT anymore. Public ground is over run with idiots come opening morning of gun season (tis why i archery hunt, more safe, less people)

Also, i personally am not a "trophy" hunter. Dont dog those that DO hunt for racks. So long as its done legally and ethically and the meat is used, have at it. But to me, the bucks with the big racks are only good for sausage, that meat in this gnarly, testosterone filled bucks is NASTY eats...for my money, i prefer 2 1/2 y/o doe...YUM!

If i may, if you are going out AFTER the opening of season to clear shooting lanes....you missed the boat. Lanes should be cleared by July, Aug. at the latest. You are rearranging the furniture in those deer living room, the smart ones (big bucks and mature doe) will avoid that area like the plague.

Good luck this season keeping the trespassers out!!
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Old 07-08-2012, 04:09 PM   #28
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FMJ....thanks for the tip. I do believe that CVA has been around for a long time. I'll check out the Wolf!
Nice pix BTW!! thanks!

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Old 07-08-2012, 04:10 PM   #29
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I myself only own a small parcel of hardwood forest behind my house, 6 acres or so and it isn't a whole lot of good for hunting so I end up hunting the public areas, and it is a real pain dealing with the other hunters sometimes, I hope to someday buy 40 or 80 acres of my own and it will be posted no trespassing, I hate to post land, used to be when my dad was young nobody around here posted land everyone hunted everywhere and it wasn't a problem then 2 of the larger land owners in the area posted and slowly it all went downhill, now everything but the paper company land is posted and that is slowly being sold off as the economy allows, its a sad time for hunters in my area. You almost have to post your land nowadays or it will be overrun like the public areas.

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Old 07-08-2012, 04:20 PM   #30
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FMJ....thanks for the tip. I do believe that CVA has been around for a long time. I'll check out the Wolf!
Nice pix BTW!! thanks!
Not a problem, anything to help someone just starting out. A lot of good quality equipment out there. The main thing is get one that is a "break action" type. The others are a real pain to load and clean.

Thanks for the compliment.

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I myself only own a small parcel of hardwood forest behind my house, 6 acres or so and it isn't a whole lot of good for hunting so I end up hunting the public areas, and it is a real pain dealing with the other hunters sometimes, I hope to someday buy 40 or 80 acres of my own and it will be posted no trespassing, I hate to post land, used to be when my dad was young nobody around here posted land everyone hunted everywhere and it wasn't a problem then 2 of the larger land owners in the area posted and slowly it all went downhill, now everything but the paper company land is posted and that is slowly being sold off as the economy allows, its a sad time for hunters in my area. You almost have to post your land nowadays or it will be overrun like the public areas.
Yep, yep, Hell i have 40 acres of cedar swamp in Dah Yooper (garden peninsula) but who can afford gas for a thousand mile round trip + $150 buck only tag.

So i am kinda relegated to public land....didnt even hunt last season. Lost mt spot on private ground....dickhead told me 2 weeks before season opened. The worst part was the youngest was working hard at getting his accuracy down to go hunting with me....that really SCREWED him. I wont take him hunting on public ground. HELL, i wont hunt public ground during gun season!
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