Need some info on my 1861 Enfield Musket

tommybommy66 · 02-03-2009, 08:14 PM

Hi, I am trying to sell a 1861 Enfield musket/muzzleloader. What I really need to know is if this is a re-manufacture or an original. See the pics below.

It is in very good condition for its age. Its wood stock is one piece. It has what looks to be an original sling on it and has ramrod. .58 caliber. It is definitely shootable.

The top reads:
ARMI SAN PAOLO-BRESCIA-ITALY
CAL. 58-3 1/2 DRAMS BLACK POWDER ONLY

Engraved by the hammer, there is a crown, and underneath the crown it reads:

1861
ENFIELD

Also, any other info that I should know would be helpful. This gun is also for sale so offers are welcome. Thanks

McNabb11b · 02-04-2009, 05:09 AM

I don't think that an original would specify between black and smokeless powder.

Hawg · 02-09-2009, 10:48 AM

It's a reproduction.

nfafan · 03-11-2009, 05:24 AM

And I'd doubt the Italians were supplying Enfields to the CSA back then...

**robocop10mm** · 03-11-2009, 01:14 PM

If that is an original, it is in better condition than the finest museum example in existance.

1861 · 03-13-2009, 01:31 AM

yep , replica

crazy_dude88 · 02-08-2010, 11:23 AM

Hello, My name is Ryan. My wife and I are just starting out in civil war re-enacting, and I was wondering if your rifle was still for sale, and for how much. Location? Thanks for your time.

Sincerely,
Ryan Buenconsejo

mag318 · 02-09-2010, 07:17 PM

The finest reproductions were made by Parker Hale in Birmingham England and imported in the 60s/70s. These were extremely good quality and used the original Enfield patterns.

Slickrick214 · 02-28-2010, 02:39 AM

It is definitely a repro. First off as mentioned the originals would not have markings to distinguish between black power and smokeless powder. At the time black powder is the only thing they had. Also they didn't call it black powder it was referred to as gun powder. Only with the invention of smokeless powder was there a need to distinguish between the two and that was long after 1861. Secondly as mentioned Italy was not supplying Enfield’s to any country, England was. The Third and final point is the markings on the lock plate are completely wrong. If it was an original it probably would have been made by Tower Arms of England. The correct markings are as follows- on the left hand side of the hammer it should have a crown over the name "Tower." On the right hand side of the hammer it should have the manf name and the city. No where on an original would you see the crown over Enfield then the date. Pictured below is an antique 1853 Enfield and you can see the difference.

MUZZLESMOKE · 03-03-2010, 03:53 AM

Yes it is a reproduction, still a good looking rifle. During the Civil War.... the South Sent gun buyers over seas. The went to France, England, Germany and other Eastern European country's. The bought as many old muskets they could. Trying always to buy 58cal. to try to only have one caliber. So they had no problems as far as supply. Sometimes they didn't get 58s, but they tried to stay with 58s. The south had no steel to make rifles or hand guns. That is why they had a lot of brass framed revolvers. That is why they went over seas. After about a year the Union started doing the same. Not because the lack of muskets. But, to try to buy them before the Rebs.
If you look at my avatar, that is an original 1857 Tower of England

Two more pictures of my Tower. However this one
I think came from the Middle East. Although all

writing is in English, not Arabic. Which they say
there should be. For me I don't care where it
comes from. It is 157 years old. And fun to
shoot.

View Poll Results: Re-Manufacture or Not?
Re-Manufacture	13	92.86%
Original, made in 1861	1	7.14%
Voters: 14. You may not vote on this poll

02-03-2009, 08:14 PM	#1
tommybommy66 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 17	Need some info on my 1861 Enfield Musket Hi, I am trying to sell a 1861 Enfield musket/muzzleloader. What I really need to know is if this is a re-manufacture or an original. See the pics below. It is in very good condition for its age. Its wood stock is one piece. It has what looks to be an original sling on it and has ramrod. .58 caliber. It is definitely shootable. The top reads: ARMI SAN PAOLO-BRESCIA-ITALY CAL. 58-3 1/2 DRAMS BLACK POWDER ONLY Engraved by the hammer, there is a crown, and underneath the crown it reads: 1861 ENFIELD Also, any other info that I should know would be helpful. This gun is also for sale so offers are welcome. Thanks Attached Thumbnails

02-04-2009, 05:09 AM	#2
McNabb11b Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Ft. Campbell Kentucky Posts: 517	I don't think that an original would specify between black and smokeless powder. __________________ "Dread Naught" "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." Sigmund Freud in "General Introduction to Psychoanalysis" "My dear boy, I love hearing my relations abused. It is the only thing that makes me put up with them at all. Relations are simply a tedious pack of people, who haven’t got the remotest knowledge of how to live, nor the smallest instinct about when to die."

03-13-2009, 01:31 AM	#6
1861 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: SW PA. Posts: 353	yep , replica __________________ Any gun owner that voted for obama is a gun owner I don't trust with a gun !

02-08-2010, 11:23 AM	#7
crazy_dude88 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 1	Is rifle still for sale? Hello, My name is Ryan. My wife and I are just starting out in civil war re-enacting, and I was wondering if your rifle was still for sale, and for how much. Location? Thanks for your time. Sincerely, Ryan Buenconsejo

02-09-2009, 10:48 AM	#3
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Mississippi, out in the boonies Posts: 376	It's a reproduction.

03-11-2009, 05:24 AM	#4
nfafan Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5	And I'd doubt the Italians were supplying Enfields to the CSA back then...

03-11-2009, 01:14 PM	#5
robocop10mm Moderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 3,803	If that is an original, it is in better condition than the finest museum example in existance.

02-09-2010, 07:17 PM	#8
mag318 Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Illinois Posts: 57	The finest reproductions were made by Parker Hale in Birmingham England and imported in the 60s/70s. These were extremely good quality and used the original Enfield patterns. Attached Thumbnails

02-28-2010, 02:39 AM	#9
Slickrick214 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 192	It is definitely a repro. First off as mentioned the originals would not have markings to distinguish between black power and smokeless powder. At the time black powder is the only thing they had. Also they didn't call it black powder it was referred to as gun powder. Only with the invention of smokeless powder was there a need to distinguish between the two and that was long after 1861. Secondly as mentioned Italy was not supplying Enfield’s to any country, England was. The Third and final point is the markings on the lock plate are completely wrong. If it was an original it probably would have been made by Tower Arms of England. The correct markings are as follows- on the left hand side of the hammer it should have a crown over the name "Tower." On the right hand side of the hammer it should have the manf name and the city. No where on an original would you see the crown over Enfield then the date. Pictured below is an antique 1853 Enfield and you can see the difference. Last edited by Slickrick214; 02-28-2010 at 04:49 PM.

03-03-2010, 03:53 AM	#10
MUZZLESMOKE Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Rocky Mountians of Colorado Posts: 18	Yes it is a reproduction, still a good looking rifle. During the Civil War.... the South Sent gun buyers over seas. The went to France, England, Germany and other Eastern European country's. The bought as many old muskets they could. Trying always to buy 58cal. to try to only have one caliber. So they had no problems as far as supply. Sometimes they didn't get 58s, but they tried to stay with 58s. The south had no steel to make rifles or hand guns. That is why they had a lot of brass framed revolvers. That is why they went over seas. After about a year the Union started doing the same. Not because the lack of muskets. But, to try to buy them before the Rebs. If you look at my avatar, that is an original 1857 Tower of England Two more pictures of my Tower. However this one I think came from the Middle East. Although all writing is in English, not Arabic. Which they say there should be. For me I don't care where it comes from. It is 157 years old. And fun to shoot. __________________ MUZZLESMOKE If you shoot black powder shoot it out of Pedersoli..... Laws are spider webs; they hold the weak and delicate who are caught in their meshes, but are torn in pieces by the rich and powerful. OUR GOVERNMENT

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