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Old 06-27-2008, 05:18 AM   #21
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To start with black powder is dangerous BUT it will not go off just by pressurizing it with a ramrod, it needs some kind of spark to ignite it. I muzzle loader can go off with out capping it and there are a few ways this can happen.

1) There is a theory that if your to rough with your ramrod it could scratch or "dent" the inside of the barrel leaving a small space for hot embers to embed itself. These embers remain lit and the following load will be ignited causing the powder to blow up in your face.

2) capping and cocking the gun before you load the next round. The theory behind this revolves again around burning embers. The spent percussion cap acts as a blocker preventing air from entering the barrel while loading. This is the same idea as an artillary gunner putting his finger over the vent of a cannon to prevent any possible embers from igniting while cleaing and loading the next round. When you put a new cap on and cock the gun before loading the next round you could allow air to enter the barrel. As everyone know fire needs oxygen (coming down the barrel while loading) and a source (the new percussion cap and the black powder). When the air enters the barrel it causes an updraft which causes the embedded embers to get hotter. This heat causes the new percussion cap to ignite or the powder to ignite causing it to all blow up in your face.

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Old 07-05-2008, 07:31 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Slickrick214 View Post
To start with black powder is dangerous BUT it will not go off just by pressurizing it with a ramrod, it needs some kind of spark to ignite it. I muzzle loader can go off with out capping it and there are a few ways this can happen.

1) There is a theory that if your to rough with your ramrod it could scratch or "dent" the inside of the barrel leaving a small space for hot embers to embed itself. These embers remain lit and the following load will be ignited causing the powder to blow up in your face.

2) capping and cocking the gun before you load the next round. The theory behind this revolves again around burning embers. The spent percussion cap acts as a blocker preventing air from entering the barrel while loading. This is the same idea as an artillary gunner putting his finger over the vent of a cannon to prevent any possible embers from igniting while cleaing and loading the next round. When you put a new cap on and cock the gun before loading the next round you could allow air to enter the barrel. As everyone know fire needs oxygen (coming down the barrel while loading) and a source (the new percussion cap and the black powder). When the air enters the barrel it causes an updraft which causes the embedded embers to get hotter. This heat causes the new percussion cap to ignite or the powder to ignite causing it to all blow up in your face.
What a crock of sh%$! Who the hell ever heard of capping and cocking a gun BEFORE pouring the powder charge down the bore! Any idiot with even half a brain knows what a danger this is... also, ramrods have brass tips...the reason being that brass is SOFTER than steel and cannot scratch it! Therefore, it is impossible to gouge your barrel with your ramrod, and even if you somehow managed to do it, this doesn't cause a "hidy-hole" for those sneaky little embers to wait to blow you up!!! Anyone that has powder ignite in their barrel is nor waiting long enough between shots...Updrafts? Air entering the barrel? Jeez -do yourself a favor, stay away from guns!
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Old 07-06-2008, 06:37 PM   #23
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What a crock of sh%$! Who the hell ever heard of capping and cocking a gun BEFORE pouring the powder charge down the bore! Any idiot with even half a brain knows what a danger this is... also, ramrods have brass tips...the reason being that brass is SOFTER than steel and cannot scratch it! Therefore, it is impossible to gouge your barrel with your ramrod, and even if you somehow managed to do it, this doesn't cause a "hidy-hole" for those sneaky little embers to wait to blow you up!!! Anyone that has powder ignite in their barrel is nor waiting long enough between shots...Updrafts? Air entering the barrel? Jeez -do yourself a favor, stay away from guns!
No I think I'll keep shooting Enfield and other Civil War guns. I've seen plenty of new people who don't know anything about black powder shooting put a new cap on thier musket then load. One of these days thier gun is going to blow up on them . I know plenty of re-enactors and black powder shooters that this has happened to. It sent them on a painful trip to the ER with third degree burns on thier hands. Sorry we can't all be guns experts like you..cocky prick.
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Old 07-06-2008, 06:51 PM   #24
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No I think I'll keep shooting Enfield and other Civil War guns. I've seen plenty of new people who don't know anything about black powder shooting put a new cap on thier musket then load. One of these days thier gun is going to blow up on them . I know plenty of re-enactors and black powder shooters that this has happened to. It sent them on a painful trip to the ER with third degree burns on thier hands. Sorry we can't all be guns experts like you..cocky prick.

And where do you shoot? The Bozo the Clown Range for the mentally challenged? Putting out "slick" crap like this is dangerous and misleading to those who wish to enjoy muzzleloading as a safe and fun sport.
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Old 07-06-2008, 06:56 PM   #25
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I shoot at my dads friends gun range and my parents friends gun range. How is it mis leading if its happened? Its obviously true. You have no idea what your talking about. Quit acting like the god of guns and get off your high horse. Your not as great as you make yourself think. Then again what do you expect from a stupid jar head living in a ****ty state like New York.

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Old 07-06-2008, 07:07 PM   #26
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I shoot at my dads friends gun range and my parents friends gun range. How is it mis leading if its happened? Its obviously true. You have no idea what your talking about. Quit acting like the god of guns and get off your high horse. Your not as great as you make yourself think. Then again what do you expect from a stupid jar head living in a ****ty state like New York.
I've been muzzleloading for more years than you are old..it's a perfectly safe sport for people with brains who are willing to learn from people who know what they are talking about. I don't claim to be an expert on anything, but one thing I have learned is to do some research before you post mis-leading crap - like brass ram-rod tips gouging out pockets in steel barrels for embers to collect, or "updraft" air causing ignition . If you shoot with a bunch of morons that load their black powder guns after capping and cocking them, I wouldn't be bragging about it, but maybe this is natures way of thinnning out the gene pool. By the way, who pissed in yours?
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:23 PM   #27
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Listen Sh%$-for-brains - do some research before you post mis-leading crap - like brass ram-rod tips gouging out pockets in steel barrels for embers to collect, or "updraft" air causing ignition . If you shoot with a bunch of morons that load black powder guns after capping and cocking them, then maybe this is natures way of thinnning out the gene pool! By the way, who pissed in yours?
Once again you prove you know nothing. We re-enactors don't use brass tipped ram-rods we do it the orginal way with the carbon steel ramrods. My point was that people are stupid and if you cap the gun before loading theres a chance it could go off. If you don't beleive me go talk to some re-enactors some time..if your not to high and mighty to get off your throne of arrogance. Your whole post show how ignorant and arrogant you are. Because you know not to cap your gun before you load your better then everyone else and everyone else are "morons". You know its to bad thousands of babies have been aborted..to bad you couldn't be one of them. It would have done the world a huge favor and would have thinned the gene pool of arrogant fools like you.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:41 PM   #28
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Ramrod tips are incapable of gouging barrels and providing areas for glowing embers to hide out. Air does not "updraft" in a barrel causing powder ignition, powder ignition is caused by percussion cap or premature loading while embers are still present from the previous firing. This is why it is not suggested to load too quickly after the last shot, or to pour powder directly into the barrel from a powder horn. There is plenty of air in the breech end of a muzzleloader barrel and nipple bolster to effect ignition - it doesn't matter how tight you pack the bullet on top of the powder charge - how do you think the powder ignites in the first place? As far as capping a gun BEFORE loading it - that is the sign of a very stupid person who shouldn't be playing with guns...

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Old 07-06-2008, 07:55 PM   #29
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that is the sign of a very stupid person who shouldn't be playing with guns...
I agree...I'm not one of them so stop attacking me. I won't load a cap before loading a powder charge. There are new people out there (re-enactors) who have done it. Luckily I have never seen someone blow thier hand off...yet. I do know of people though who have done it before and the cap did go off giving the person 3rd degree burns on thier hands. There is also a Revolutionary War re-enactor I met who was dumb enough to be holding a round in his hand when he was shooting his flintlock. He took two rounds out of his cartridge box. He primed his pan then loaded the charge into his gun. Still holding the other charge in his right hand (the hand closest to the lock and frizzen) he pulled the trigger and the sparks from the flinlock ignited the cartridge which blew up in his hand and caused bad burns on his hand. He was rushed to the ER where they had to scrub the wound and irrigate it to prevent infection. It was very painful and he said he would make sure he never had a round in his hand when shooting. The guy seemed a little goofy though and for some reason it didn't surprise me that this would happen to him. My point is people are dumb. people rush and make mistakes..mistakes that could be deadly. Again I would never place the cap on the gun before loading and I would never hold a round in my hand while shooting.

Also notice I said THEORY..I never said it was proven. For as long as I've been re-enacting and shooting black powder I have not seen on barrel that has had dents in it from a ram rod tip.
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Old 07-06-2008, 10:48 PM   #30
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Sorry for the insults - It sounded like you were promoting some of the stuff you were obviously not involved with. I have had bad experiences with people at public ranges shooting muzzleloading rifles and revolvers for the first time - one of them almost took my thumb off because the idiot didn't grease the chambers of the cylinder on his .44 repro colt. He had a chain fire and 3 chambers ignited simultaneously. I was occupying the spot to his left when he was loading his revolver. He also capped it BEFORE loading the cylinder. One ball deflected off the barrel tenon and hit my hand. I too spent the afternoon in the emergency room having my hand "debrided". It swelled up so bad I thought the ball had lodged in my thumb. The idiot was arrested because he also was unaware of the law requiring a pistol permit to shoot black powder revolvers. Apparently the range staff who collected his fee for shooting didn't bother checking either. I probably could have sued him and the range, but there are too few ranges around and I didn't want to become part of the problem rather than part of the solution. Almost a month to the day later, two spaces down on the firing line from me some jerk sent his ramrod flying into the roof covering the firing line. Pieces of ramrod splinters showered several people including myself. They now check everyones "qualifications" at that range before letting anyone on the firing line. I no longer use public ranges or hunt on public land - too many idiots, too many drunks, and too many "know-it-all's" for my benefit...

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