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Old 07-06-2012, 06:14 AM   #21
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My skeet career is not going well and still haven't figured out jamming issues.

ROA is on my "To Do" list. Got to buy some powder and find some 7.62 brass for powder measure or pay Cabelas for powder holder w adj powder measure. I used to clean it w warm soapy water and then alcohol rub down to displace water.

After WCs post w 35 gr. maybe I should back down a bit - work my way back up. I seem to recall huge cylinders as well and I even filled it to the rim once. Can't kill an ROA - this was my teenage years. Very thankful I survived them.

Always wanted one of those LeMat revolvers the Southern Calvery loved so much. Didn't know they used to shoot horses w them. Then again, fastest way to dismount a rider. .

Bullet Trivia: ever heard of the Williams Cleaner Patent .58 caliber ? 3 piece bullet that actually cleaned the barrel as it was fired. Was issued one of these for every 10 rounds.

Picket Bullets actually predate the civil war and were also used in Kentucky & Penn Rifles. Wonder if Midway USA carries .452 conical lead rds ?

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Old 07-06-2012, 05:57 PM   #22
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WC - just for posterity (& my unnatural curiosity) w you mind a wee bit of experimentation ?

Will a 45 LC penetrate ? 45 ACP ?

I'm sure Terry's help will be invaluable in this endeavor, and we'll shed some light on the subject and maybe even in your shed.

Back to BP - will 40 gr. make a difference ? 45 ?

How about a Pickett Bullets ? Not sure about availability but it wouldn't surprise me if Terry had an 18 century bullet mold.

We need to make this as scientific as possible to withstand the doubt of even the hardest core FTF member. Then again, if they don't appreciate the effort, the hell w them !.

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Old 07-06-2012, 06:46 PM   #23
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I can tell ya, the .45ACP pokes a hole in it, I had a piece of sheet from one of the old tanks, we have several, and I just popped a couple shots of 230fmj at it, from 50 yards, expecting to dent it good, and it simply blew thru, so my .45LC with 275gr Keiths at 1100 sure gonna make a hole in it.

I havent tried 40 grains, I'm sure it will hold it, that would be an original .45 Colt load. Soons I get these research plots taken care of, I'll try it. Pickets would be fun fo sho. I'll see whut I kin dig up here,,, I'm bettin if I was closer it would make a difference too. What we are experimenting with is the Hickock/Tutt gunfight here, essentially, as the accepted distance there was 75 yards. The .36 cal ball struck Tutt in the ribs, and he ran up onto the porch and back into the street and dropped. If I recall, the bullet took out the 6th rib.

Lets keep this goin. I dont have anything I can use to substitute for a picket. Round ball will have to do for this weekend. If the rb punches it, then there wouldnt be any question about a conical.

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Old 07-06-2012, 08:48 PM   #24
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Hickcock/Tutt - 75 yd chest shot w someone trying to shoot back is remarkable or just damn lucky - your choice.

Do you think the distance is accurate or is it like one of my hunting/fishing stories...I do my best to carry on the New England Tradition. .

Was reading about a article about bullets from 1861-1865 and he has one hell of a collection. Even had a "pain bullet" where they literally gave the patient a bullet to bite on. Don't know what they did to the poor fellow but his teeth marks are still evident.

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Old 07-06-2012, 09:53 PM   #25
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It's marked on the street in Springfield where it happened, I always wanted to stop in there and see for myself..I think there is a Missouri historical page on it.

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Old 07-06-2012, 10:03 PM   #26
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Bill do you cast bullets? I use the Lee Rem. Bullet .200 gr. mold for the 58'. Hell,nothing to it. Just pour them and tumble them in a plastic pail in Lee Alox let them dry and have some fun. Put some T7 under them and you got kill'in power. I will post some test loads etc.with calculated energy from an ROA. Damn impressive. Mike you can use some 3F Pyrodex they should have that around there. The problem with the ROAs is the front sights are too low and they will throw 5" high at a sight in range of 12 yards. The older Mdls. have stacked sights "Ouch". The later ones are pinned easy to change out.

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Old 07-06-2012, 10:14 PM   #27
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I am sure "Wild Bill" was using a paper Ctg. with a bullet not a ball. He was known to have been a very good handgun shot. Yes a 180 gr. soft lead bullet will go thru a 1" pine board at 75 yds. I really think he did it. Everyone in town paced it off. He of course was arrested also and there was the Police reports. Well what the Hell Bill told Tut to not show off the watch. It was a fued between a Union veteran and a CSA veteran . I will post an 80 Yd. test on a ROA load.

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Old 07-06-2012, 10:16 PM   #28
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Dont have some T7, but I might possibly be able to find 50 pounds of real stuff here and there.

We'll play with some a them. I've been impressed with the round balls, I have a bucket full of them already. I have used the alox on other bullets.

Stories of Hickock and Tutt run from 50 feet to 100 yards. I cant find the page from the Springfield historical association with the pictures, it seems to me that it was 60 that they called. 60 feet would seem mo-better than 75 yards,,,I'm settin here lookin out the window, at 75 yards. I could hit a man at that distance, I'm pretty sure, and Im sure that the old timers could too, they knew their guns and shot at longer ranges that we are used to. I have killed deer with my .45 at 75 yards. I think it is quite possible, but who knows what is really true of that account?

Lemme get one a them boolit makers and get some a them boolits made, and we shall then let the research begin what we can do with one. It'll do anything a 200 grain .45 will do, that's for sure. Rb is 144 grains, so the conical oughta do better...lets keep this alive.

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Old 07-06-2012, 10:19 PM   #29
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JB was Union, Tutt was Confederate, and they already had it out for each other, then came the worst element of all between them, the same woman.........

The card game was just an excuse for the fight.

Its still 103 freaking degrees here, and I'm not gonna go out in that to shoot today. I'll catch one of these mornings when the edge is off and see what I can come up with.

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Old 07-07-2012, 05:44 AM   #30
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Here is Wiki s view - well, its better than the story I was told...fighting over money, greed, pride. - sounds to much like the news.

At a few minutes before 6 p.m., Hickok was seen calmly approaching the square from the south, his Colt Navy in hand. His armed presence caused the crowd to immediately scatter to the safety of nearby buildings, leaving Tutt alone in the northwestern corner of the square. At a distance of about 75 yards (70 meters), Hickok stopped, facing Tutt, and called out, "Dave, here I am." He cocked his pistol, holstered it on his hip, and gave a final warning, "Don't you come across here with that watch." Tutt did not reply, but stood with his hand on his pistol.[3]
Davis Tutt was acknowledged as the better marksman, but both showed courage by all accounts. Both men faced each other sideways in the dueling position and hesitated briefly. Then Tutt reached for his pistol. Hickok drew his gun and steadied it on his opposite forearm. The two men fired a single shot each at essentially the same time, according to the reports. Tutt missed, but Hickok's bullet struck Tutt in the left side between the fifth and seventh ribs. Tutt called out, "Boys, I'm killed," ran onto the porch of the local courthouse and back to the street, where he collapsed and died.[3]

Well - witness said he cocked his pistol then put it in his holster. Hickcock did not have a holster. He carried his Colts in his sash.

Do you buy the cocking first ? Seems like a dangerous practice but he was about to begin a duel. Hollywood never shows him using his other arm to steady his aim.

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