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Fumbles 10-19-2011 07:48 PM

Telescopic sight question.
LOL.....I am getting ahead of myself and into trouble I know. They had this 'scope on sale and the write up's on it were very good to excellent for the price.....with the only real complaint being that the reticle is too thick.

I bought it anyway. With the rebate it will end up being $100. Simmons Whitetail Classic 6.5-20X50. Only thing........ I did not realize looking at the picture online, how big this thing is.:eek:Yowza!!!!:eek: This is a big boy!

Well, to get to my question......... Does the front sight HAVE to be removed?(duh!)

Have a look at this pic. This is exactly what it will look like.....exact same setup, Burris sight mount etc.

Looking at it, that front sight is right in the sight picture.

I have never looked through a setup like this, but have seen quite a few pictures of AR's like this. I reckon some people might have folding sights, but how does this turn out? Is there just a shadow on the sight picture from the front sight because it is so close or is the sight picture completely compromised in a setup like this?

That said, is the front sight easily removable and if it is something a handy person can do with minimal tools, what do you guys recommend? A setup with rail and some sort of front sight that clips on....a folder, none at all.......what's the general consensus? Is there a setup that has the ability to attach a bipod etc.

Thanks! (And thanks to Quentin who I never got to thanking on my last thread.)

Quentin 10-19-2011 08:40 PM

Fumbles, thanks for the thanks! :D

With such a high magnification you won't need to replace the A2 FSB and you shouldn't see any shadow. I know it's hard to believe but that's the way it works with telephoto optics. Now if you had wide angle like a camera, then the FSB would be drawn into the field of view - or with a 1x or 2x scope.

Also, the FSB usually is difficult to remove and then you're stuck with finding something else and hoping you don't screw up the gas system. I wouldn't recommend that someone new to ARs try it himself. Some FSBs come off easy and some pins are really in there, plus you have to know if they're tapered and which way. (Kinda like my dumb neighbor years ago with a breaker bar and bat trying to take out his spark plugs. I had to remind him of 'righty-tighty, lefty-loosey'. :p )

Hopefully your mount is high enough for a comfortable cheek weld and you have enough eye relief but that cantilever mount should take care of the latter.

c3shooter 10-19-2011 09:22 PM

And not that you asked, but that is a LOT of glass for that rifle. At high mag, you will have a very small "field of view". I use something similar on varmint rifles- but that is when shooting at little bitty critters like prairie dogs a long way out.

Fumbles 10-20-2011 12:22 AM

Thanks again Quentin, that puts my mind at ease. I wondered if, since it was so close it would just be a vague shadow.....I was concerned it would be visible and annoying.

Yes c3shooter, I considered that when I researched it and figured I would still give it a try at that price. I got the impression it was still a very decent scope for casual shooting.

Places to shoot are few and far between in So.Cal.....when I do go I like to challenge myself to hit things far away. Even with the steel targets, I get bored after a while with my larger caliber handguns.....and double taps are frowned down upon, so any sort of combat practice is hard...multiple plates etc.....advancing on a target and going from primary to secondary.

So I love the distant target.

In your experience will this amount of glass be totally unsuitable for the distances I will be shooting at....100-300 yds?
Not sure what an AR is typically good for?

Should I rather look for less magnification, in a different 'scope?

I had a 2X Weaver on my Colt .357 Magnum until it quit working...loved it. I got quite a few years out of it....and wanted to transfer it to the Super Blackhawk....but something dropped down in front of the front a weather seal or paper gasket.

Thanks for the interest and the help you guys. I am totally willing to listen to what you guys say and take it into consideration. I really enjoy any help I can get, appreciate it and will likely be asking a lot until I am well versed on AR's.

As a shooter I am no newbie......had guns since 1972 or so, spent time in the military and was an avid shooter at one point. I actually wanted to shoot competition but left it too long. Then with the cost of it and my income at the time...I just faded out of shooting a lot. Now I go once in a while to keep my hand and eye in it. Oh....getting older and needing glasses SUCKS!!!!

Sorry, just wanted to get that off my chest.:D

For me the AR platform is gonna be my new enjoyment, maybe shoot alone a lot or with buddies here and there......but it will be my hobby....although I hate that word. But you know what I mean. I might even drag out all my reloading gear, from storage, and set it back up.

I just LOVE that there are so any customizing options for AR's.....wonderful. AR's are the new Harley in a way. Soooooo popular. Everyone and his cuz has one. When a new run of stuff comes in at my local gun shop, it get's vacuumed up in a very short time.


Blackbeard1718 10-20-2011 12:59 AM


CONGRATS! The Whitetail is a Great Scope! I have one mounted on my M&P 15-22, and it keeps me happy.

Yes..... it IS a Big Dawg, isn't it? When I put my Dust Cover on it, the Front Bell Cover touches the Rail Cover, but still has enough room to slide On/Off easily enough.

Have you ever used a Scope with AO (Adjustable Objective) before? I just bought a Nitrex 4-16x50 with AO for my RRA LAR-15 a couple of weeks ago, and it's great. I wear glasses too, and the AO's make a big difference for me, working together with the Magnification and Focus.

Do me a favor..... let me know how it holds Zero after say, 500 Rounds. If it stays put, I may switch it off of my .22, and move it up to one of my 9mm Carbines.





Fumbles 10-20-2011 01:42 AM

Thanks Blackbeard1718. No I have not used an AO before. I run into that with my camera all the time.......if I switch over to full manual....I gotta watch the focus. Damn progressive lenses are the worst.

Do you shoot with your glasses or do you set the AO or diopter etc while not wearing lenses?

Thanks for the encouragement.

That Weaver Nitrex looks super. I hope it gives you a lot of enjoyment.

I will try my best to remember to let you know about how it holds zero.

Thanks you guys.

Blackbeard1718 10-20-2011 04:07 AM


Originally Posted by Fumbles (Post 605639)

I gotta watch the focus. Damn progressive lenses are the worst.

Do you shoot with your glasses or do you set the AO or diopter etc while not wearing lenses?

I wear Progressive Lenses too. Have been for several years now.

Yes, I wear my glasses, in addition to a pair of Over-Safety-Glasses when I shoot. I got them from my local Glasses Shop, where I get my Prescription Glasses made. These are designed to go over regular Prescription Glasses, and cover the sides of the eyes as well. They came in Clear, Dark, and Amber Lenses. I picked up a pair of the Amber Lens, and they are very Clear and focus very well on details when I'm shooting. I paid about $50 for them, IIRC.

Remember that movie, "A Christmas Story?" Well... it's a true statement about the, "You'll shoot your eye out!", with a BB Gun. When I was a kid, I was in the backyard shooting my BB Gun. I had my regular prescription glasses on while I was shooting. I was REALLLLLY glad I'm Right-Eye Dominant that day. I had my right eye open, shooting at my Dad's empty Beer Cans, and had my left eye closed. After a few shots, I felt my head pop back just a bit, and opened my left eye. I couldn't see out of the left side. I pulled my glasses off, and the left lens was cracked right in the center, and there was a small "BB" sized crater in the middle. Fortunately, the BB didn't go all of the way through, or leave any broken shards on the inside of the lens. Ever since then..... I wear my Glasses and Safety Glasses while shooting. I know a couple of pair of Plastic Lenses won't do much to stop a .22, .223, .380, or 9mm, but at least it'll keep an ejecting shell casing or powder out of my eyes.

When I'm using my AO Scopes, I'll set my Magnification where I want it, Tune it up a bit with the AO for a better picture, then Fine Tune it with the Focus, to make sure I've got a crisp and clear Reticle.

If I'm using my Non-AO Scope (Redfield Revolution), it's a bit tougher to get a Clear Crisp Picture, with just the Magnification and Focus. I'm sure for anyone else it wouldn't be a problem, but with Progressive Lenses, I need all of the extra Sight help I can get.



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